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June 20, 2008 12:01am by David Farrar

General Debate 20 June 2008

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General Debate

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big bruv

Ha ha ha..come on Phul, you really have to stop doing this, my sides are hurting from laughing so much.
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June 20, 2008 9:08pm
capills_enema

“But tell me, how is Hussein Obama going to end poverty”

Fuck me sideways… Hussein Obama??? Is that really his name? Why, if this is the case, then we must all coalesce against him and vote for the old white guy again, right?…. Islamofascism… dhimmitude… etc, etc… rhubarb…. etc.
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June 20, 2008 9:16pm
Short Shriveled and Slightly to the Left

so whats the National equivalent SR?
“I vote National because I want to keep all the policies Labour has introduced but I want bigger tax cuts, oh and I hate gays…and the Maori. I wish National would take away gay rights again. They wont but I’ll vote for them anyway for the tax cut.”
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June 20, 2008 9:18pm
Short Shriveled and Slightly to the Left

Yeah I know that was generalistic crap, but so was yours
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June 20, 2008 9:24pm
Southern Raider

The left just has no sense of humour. Who said we hate gays and maori’s? Last time I checked we had both in parliment as MP’s.

Phil if the banking system fails how are you going to withdraw your dole money? You might have to start growing your own vegetables.
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June 20, 2008 9:27pm
Strutta

Southern Raider’s friend’s take off of the left’s video “Why I’m voting Republican” is brilliant no matter which side of the political spectrum you are on. The original is a very good bit of political bashing and the response is even better. Unfortunately, hardliners fronm both sides will see one as absolute truth and the other as partisan lies.

What I find difficult to understand is why people like philu, roger nome, and dad4justice reply to jibes with ad hominems or abuse. I tend to give d4j a bit more leeway because of his experiences with the courts. As for sonic and roger, I often skip past their posts because they fail to respond to the thrust of a thread. Instead, they start by saying, in effect “But what about….” as though one misdead justifies a worse one. You guys appear to be fairly well educated by NZ standards. Why do you repeatedly fail to discuss an issue but seem to prefer to divert the discussion to irrelevant issues/events?
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June 20, 2008 9:39pm
philu

there is one fact you need to ‘hold’..

that is that the sub-prime ‘crisis’ in america is just beginning..

and will not ‘peak’ until the end of 2009..

got that..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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June 20, 2008 9:39pm
dad4justice

“The left just has no sense of humour.”

I second that MADam speaker!!
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June 20, 2008 9:40pm
tom hunter

Humour? When Marty delivered the following he could never imagined how appropriate the send-up would be for a new class of True Believers:

http://standanddeliver.blogs.com/dombo/files/Marty_weather.mp3
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June 20, 2008 9:43pm
Chicken Little

So Phule – Are you telling us you’re just sitting there on the DPB waiting for the end of the world as we know it?, which only you and a few chosen others know about?, and the End will result in a new beginning with all the poor folks raised up?

Shit, where have I heard this stuff before?

Who says being a greenie ain’t a religion?

Mate, to tell you the truth, I’d be more worried about your kid having a long term beneficiary as a role model, maybe you should put your mind to that dilemma a little more, we live through our descendants don’t ya know?

At least give the kid a chance.
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June 21, 2008 5:07am
expat

Ken Douglas – care of Wiki

“An acknowledged Marxist, Douglas has moved to the right over the last two decades and sits on Air New Zealand and New Zealand Post Boards. He is also chairperson of Positively Wellington Business and a board member of the Asia NZ Foundation.

Douglas has come under increasing criticism from the New Zealand trade union movement for refusing to use his position on Air New Zealand’s Board of Directors to stop the airline from cutting the pay and conditions of its workers under threat of outsourcing.”

And Ken has far far more street cred than any one of you little laborite commie wanna be standard flunkies.
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June 21, 2008 5:27am
OECD rank 22 kiwi

The Fairfax Media-Nielsen poll on stuff makes for interesting reading.

Labour has well and truly lost Auckland. The only ethnic group keeping the faith are Pacific Islanders. Even Maori think National is tops compared to Labour.

More swing voters sit with Labour so a landslide to National looks all but inevitable now.

Once again demonstrating that Labour has a massive leadership deficit,Labour voters say they have no alternative to Hels and want her to helm the sinking ship. Which is nice. 😉

Less than four months now to elections and it’s now a dead cert sure thing that Labour is going down like clown. John Key is Prime Minister in waiting with not much longer to wait.

Tick tock tick tock!
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June 21, 2008 5:27am
OECD rank 22 kiwi

31,200 to Australia for the year ended May 2008.

Only 600 off the all time record of 31,800 in the year ended May 2001.

I’m sure Labour can do the honours and beat its own record in the four months remaining before it is turfed out of office.

Abject failure is the only way to sum up Labour and Hels legacy.

What a waste.
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June 21, 2008 5:48am
Lee C

OECD
Stuff’s article reads like the captain of the Titanic thanking god that he had now some ice to put in ihis G&T!

I don’t know what you were reading it says Helen is preferred PM amongst labour voters – so no leadership challenge. It says Labour gained three points agaisnt national and it says labour has gained support in Wellington. On this article I’d suggest tah there is a rumbling sea-bed revival of Labour which will return Helen with a landslide victory.
All they will need to do is click their heels together three times and say “Thers’s no place like home!”

or something.
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June 21, 2008 6:44am
expat

Clearly the labore PR machine isnt the beast it used to be Lee. And are you suggesting that labore are made up of the friends of dorothy?
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June 21, 2008 6:55am
philu

was ken douglas’ ‘move to the right’..before or after he just turned around and bent over for his (sir)namesake..?

the craven acquiesance of ken douglas/our union movement..to the demands of the rogernomes..

contributed in no small way..to the creation/sustaining of our current low-wage economy..

and the mess we now find ourselves in..

that rightwing fuckwits like you hold him up for praise..

and his ‘board-positions’..

are just more evidence of the degree of/payout for..

.his historical/ongoing ‘sellouts’..

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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June 21, 2008 7:55am
Patrick Starr

I like the Fairfax 10 months averages showing 52% Nats to 33.5% Lab. The only unfortunate trend is the Greens getting another ‘hockey stick’
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June 21, 2008 8:12am
expat

grow a brain phil – ken douglas did more for the union movement and workers in NZ than the majority of the academic liberal tossers who make up the “labour” (nu-labour champagne socialists) party now.

the rogernomes and richardson-nomes stopped this country being repossesed by the creditors.

now its time to move the country forward again, out of the PC handwringing backwater that we have got stuck in.

🙂 hth’s
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June 21, 2008 8:59am
philu

don’t try and rewrite history..xpat..

why do you think the aussie workers are much better off..?

ie..no low-wage economy..?

it’s because the unions ove there..at about the time douglas/oiur union ‘leadership’ had their trousers around their ankles..

..said ‘no you’re fucken not!”..

they stood up..

whereas ours..in the main..were craven lickspittles..

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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June 21, 2008 9:17am
expat

its because australia has a rich minerals industry – we have dairy & meat & fruit, the australians have mineral wealth. guess which one is more valuable?

the aussies have dumb luck , we have dumb commies.

ken douglas did do more for unions than the majority of nu-labours champagne socialist good time commies.

roger douglas and ruth richardson did stop this country going bankrupt.

hulun and her mates have done some good things restoring some social balance to the country.

unfortunately the balance has tipped too far and the pc academic student union brigade alongside a few teachers in cabinet have been pissing it up against the wall.

hulun and mikhael out – give us some new leadership.
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June 21, 2008 9:30am
ghostwhowalks3

The liquor outlets in Otara…
Even the owners say too much competition drives prices down
It’s quiet now, with just him and another worker present. Business will pick up around 4pm, they say, when workers start to head home.
Their customers will see one of the biggest deals going _ five types of one litre spirits at $6.99 each or three for $20.

For that price it’s not the top shelf stuff _ Kentucky Blue, Kristov Red, Mad Jacks Gold, Carthews Gin and Napoleon Brandy are the picks.
Leaning against trees are multiple two metre-long sandwich boards, for the most part advertising ready to drink specials _ 12 KGBs for $19.99.

A can of pre-mixed bourbon costs the same as a soft drink in many parts of south Auckland.

And in spite of the garbage from Whaleoil..( out of date stats?)
Manukau’s licensed premises

* Manurewa 91

* Howick 82

* Mangere 69

* Pakuranga 59

* Papatoetoe 58

* Botany 51

* Otara 50

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/1/story.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10517582
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June 21, 2008 9:39am
ghostwhowalks3

So Roger and Ruth saved the country from going bankrupt ?

Funny that they were both sacked from their jobs
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June 21, 2008 9:42am
getstaffed

GWW – they weren’t really suitable. neither are gay, neither are socialist/communist and both have ‘traditional’ families.
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June 21, 2008 9:50am
Lee C

f**k me I must be getting old. That previous post from GWW about booze outlets was actually interesting – made refreshing because it didn’t include any opinions, apart from an obligatory stab at d4j.
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June 21, 2008 10:09am
PhilBest

Sothern Raider, yesterday, 6.15 PM. BRILLIANT. BRILLIANT. BRILLIANT. I am printing that out and framing it……….

For those who came in late……….

Southern Raider (336) +17 Says:

June 20th, 2008 at 6:15 pm
“Roger, Sonic, Natural Party etc now I understand where your coming from

WHY I’M VOTING LABOUR

I’m voting Labour because being part of a collective gives me a warm, fuzzy feeling all over. Yes, we’re all individuals.

I’m voting Labour because common sense and the most basic of intelligence tells me Communism will never work regardless of how many different ways and times you try it, and will actually cause more harm than good.

I’m voting Labour because true Communism has never been tried, and all it needs is another 70 years and 120 million deaths for it to work.

I’m voting Labour because New Zealand is run by the Business Round Table.

I’m voting Labour because businesses create oppression and governments create prosperity.

I’m voting Labour because big corporations (powerful entities with lots of money made from selling people goods and services they want to buy), can’t be trusted; but Big Government (a powerful entity with lots of money robbed at gunpoint from its rightful owners), can be.

I’m voting Labour because I need to be told what is good and bad for me.

I’m voting Labour because I can’t think for myself.

I’m voting Labour because rich people should be told just how “fair” their fair share really is, without ever defining what “rich” is (thus leaving the door open to the state-sponsored plunder of as many people as possible).

I’m voting Labour because thinking for myself is redundant when a politician or bureaucrat with a sociology degree has the best handle on what’s good for me, how to spend my money, how to educate my children etc.

I’m voting Labour because I believe the government should be able to take the property and income I’ve worked for, and give it to someone else who refuses to work or save.

I’m voting Labour because I don’t pay enough tax.

I’m voting Labour because I want more radical-left judicial appointments.

I’m voting Labour because I care about the real victims of crime — criminals.

I’m voting Labour because everyone deserves crappy healthcare. Sure, you’ll have to wait years for that life-saving cancer surgery. But it’s first come, first served at the cemetery!

I’m voting Labour because motorists aren’t paying enough for petrol.

I’m voting Labour because if I don’t have enough money, the solution is for the government to take more of my money. After all, who needs money when petrol is $2.11 per litre?

I’m voting Labour because it looks like they’re going to hit “greedy” oil companies with windfall profits taxes, which means I get to pay even more for fuel.

I’m voting Labour because truth and justice are too judgmental.

I’m voting Labour because one day, I will be a victim too.

I’m voting Labour because I don’t understand human nature or economics, and I don’t want to.

I’m voting Labour because that I believe that two people can live off one another indefinitely without working.

I’m voting Labour because I love that warm glow associated with the redistribution of other people’s money.

I’m voting Labour because I feel guilty for having always worked hard. Now I want to give everything to some worthless slot who went out and got pregnant at age 15 so she could stop going to school and live off other people for the rest of her life.

I’m voting Labour because paying more than 50 percent of my income in combined taxes is not enough and I want to subsidise more illegal immigrants and hip hop tours.

I’m voting Labour because I cannot be successful without the government taking care of me.

I’m voting Labour because I hate having to make decisions for myself.

I’m voting Labour because I’d prefer to live in a state house.

I’m voting Labour because I am tired of working for a living. I want a benefit.

I’m voting Labour because I ‘m entitled to everyone else’s success, no matter how much harder they worked or how much more risk they took.

I’m voting Labour because I want one of those free converter boxes I keep hearing about for my TV. I hope it works on the new 65″ flat screen that I bought with the rich honky tonks’ tax money. Lord knows I deserve it for raising all these children on my own.

I’m voting Labour because I want smart people who worked hard all their life to pay for my bad choices and self-inflicted shortcomings.

I’m voting Labour because I am a victim of every earthly affliction.

I’m voting Labour because CO2 emissions must be drastically reduced to save our planet, even if our living standards revert to those prevailing in the Dark Ages.

I’m voting Labour because I believe we need other countries’ permission for me to use my heater or drive an SUV.

I’m voting Labour because hunters and fisherman don’t care about the environment, but loony activists who’ve never set foot outside the faculty lounge and Starbucks do.

I’m voting Labour because any person who flushes his travel documents on the plane should get massive legal aid to stay in New Zealand, bring out their whole family, and go on the dole.

I’m voting Labour because I believe making peace signs at people whose declared intention is to kill me will make them go away.

I’m voting Labour because I want the United Nations to govern my country.

I’m voting Labour because I was thinking about converting to Islam anyway.

I’m voting Labour because one day I want to press #4 for English.

I’m voting Labour because all this white guilt is killing me.

I’m voting Labour because the Treaty of Waitangi is a “living document” requiring periodic editing from unelected activist judges.

I’m voting Labour because the real cure for racism is hate speech laws and preferential policies based on race.

I’m voting Labour because young Kiwis should be brainwashed at school instead of learning dumb stuff like Maths and English.

I’m voting Labour because I’d rather everybody was illiterate and ignorant and never questioned anything the government does as long as Nanny State guarantees that I can live off other people for the rest of my life.

I’m voting Labour because I don’t like the English language and prefer being forced to learn Maori.

I’m voting Labour because after 17 years in higher education I realise an inflated and unjustified sense of self-esteem is more important than teaching kids to read, write, or critically analyse anything.

I’m voting Labour because Maori and Polynesian students with inferior Bursary results deserve preferential admission to limited entry university courses.

I’m voting Labour because competitive examinations are racist, but racial quotas aren’t.

I’m voting Labour because I enjoy being humiliated and told my beliefs are no longer welcomed in this “enlightened” society.

I’m voting Labour because the only hate speech I approve of is against white people.

I’m voting Labour because, as a European New Zealander, I accept the blame for all the problems, failings and personal inadequacies of anyone with a brown skin.

I’m voting Labour because Pakeha racism is responsible for Maori pathology, even though we don’t put a gun to Maori heads and make them sleep around at age 12, give birth to underweight premature babies in their teens, drink, smoke and take drugs, drop out of high school, beat their children to death, or commit crimes that send them to jail.

I’m voting Labour because I am against the death penalty for known murderers, but in favour of abortion-on-demand of unborn innocents.

I’m voting Labour because it’s my body, and if I want to kill my baby, I’ll do it, even if its head is in the birth canal.

I’m voting Labour because foetal parasites are the true enemy of the state.

I’m voting Labour because Sue Bradford and Cindy Kiro care more about children than their parents do.

I’m voting Labour because the same teacher who can’t teach five year olds how to read is somehow qualified to teach those same kids about sex.

I’m voting Labour because gender roles are artificial, but homosexuality is natural.

I’m voting Labour because the institution of marriage should be expanded to include people of the same sex, multiple partners, and even animals.

I’m voting Labour because the ideal family is two homosexual bonobos, a goat and a parrot raising a human baby. Love and compassion is all it takes to make a successful family.

I’m voting Labour because I want to marry my cat. We love each other. I can’t visit him at the vet when he’s sick. It’s not fair. I’m entitled to his tinkle ball and his litter tray when he passes too.

I’m voting Labour because gay pride parades celebrating cross-dressing, sodomy, and bestiality are “legitimate forms of self-expression” but manger scenes and Christmas Carols should be removed from the public square lest they offend non-Christians.

I’m voting Labour because I enjoy reach-arounds from Chris Carter and Tim Barnett.

I’m voting Labour because thinking is much harder than feeling.

I’m voting Labour because I hate freedom.

I’m voting Labour because my feminist girlfriend said she’d dump me if I didn’t.

I’m voting Labour because family values are important. I love my Big Sister, Auntie Helen.”
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June 21, 2008 10:23am
Lee C

SHouldn’t this be posted n the VDS? I mean it’s a bit redundant here…
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June 21, 2008 10:25am
getstaffed

from stuff article “Aussie exodus baffles bureaucrats” : With a focus on inward migration, the Labour Department has no idea why people are leaving, and has commissioned research to find out why.
They have no idea because….
1. They haven’t been ‘told’ what answers to provide yet
2. The smart bureaucrats have already left for Oz
3. Their is little to differentiate Labour Department bureaucrats from Ostriches
4. Admitting having any ideas would negate the need for more commissioned research… and that budget must be spent
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June 21, 2008 10:30am
Patrick Starr

GWW I recall the outcry from the left when Howard tried to stop Aboriginals from easy access to alcohol? Aren’t you promoting the same concept?

If alcohol is still legal then it is anyone with a liquor license right to sell it for what they want. Otherwise you have to just accept that some ethnicities can’t handle it and ban alcohol sale to them.

I’m unsure though what the price of alcohol, and how many liquor stores there are have to do with Singhs shooting?
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June 21, 2008 10:40am
PhilBest

big bruv, yesterday, 8.55 PM; Southern Raider, 9.27PM; Chicken Little, 5.07 AM today: SCORE between you guys and “philu”; 10 nil to you guys.

I have said these things before to philu, and he doen’t like it. A right-wing reformer finance minister might make it tougher for him. An unreconstituted left-wing government will only continue to make it tougher for all of us, INCLUDING HIM AND HIS BOY, in the long run. (That includes the likes of the Obamessiah if he were to become president of the US of A; only it is more likely to stuff up the whole WORLD than if McCain makes it). A full-on economic crash, which I think possible, is the ONLY situation in which it will DEFINITELY be “kiss goodbye to your benefit and get off your arse and plant things to eat instead of smoke, philu”…………

The only explanations I can think of for his mirth over the advent of either the Obamessiah or a Kiwi equivalent, or his mirth over the impending crash of the filthy system of world capitalism, are; masochism; sheer hatred of everyone better off than himself (his type would rather rather everyone was starving than that there be inequality with everyone fed); brain too addled by substance abuse to grasp reality…..
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June 21, 2008 10:44am
ghostwhowalks3

The outcry wasnt over the easy access to alcohol.
Indeed some remote communities had self imposed alcohol bans
It was more about the sending in of the military etc
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June 21, 2008 11:11am
ghostwhowalks3

Philbest is too stupid to relise hes copying something written in the US, with democrat replaced by Labour and some other details added

I’m voting Labour because I want to marry my cat. !

Take their cat off a lot of people at your peril
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June 21, 2008 11:16am
big bruv

And Ghost is too stupid to realise that Labour are stuffed, the public know it yet for some reason Ghost and co refuse to admit it.
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June 21, 2008 11:36am
Southern Raider

Why is Phil always going on about repressed workers, minimum wages and not enough union powers when he doesn’t work?

Or is he waiting until the minimum wage hits $100/hr and then he will grace the work force with his presence?

Phil you are a very sad man and a bludger. Its all good to look after your kids, but its strange that you attack the hand that feeds you i.e tax payers.
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June 21, 2008 11:41am
ghostwhowalks3

Labour is a long way from nationals 20% vote in 2002.

now THAT was stuffed . But great old Simon English is back in charge as co leader to slippery key
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June 21, 2008 11:52am
philu

“..Philbest is too stupid..”

aah..!..something we can all agree on..!

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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June 21, 2008 12:40pm
JSF2008

I am sure, Sophie Lewis mother was happy that her daughter called herself ANGEL in the tabloids and papers, sounds better than CANDY (good working girl trade name :), and getting paid $12000 for discribing her sexual exploits, with a english energizer rabbit rugby player. this is better pay than on tv, i see a career change coming up (ps was the pom married) , could be interesting for the wifes left behind,lots of questions asked 🙂 🙂
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June 21, 2008 1:40pm
Chuck Bird

Should the doctor in the article below be charged because he gave totally inaccurate and misleading information regarding the effectiveness of HIV medication in reducing the risk of spreading HIV? If the answer is yes then should not health authorities here and in particular he NZ AIDS Foundation be held to account for greatly exaggerating the effective ness of condoms in preventing the spread of HIV particularly amongst the homosexual community?

Why is it acceptable to continually highlight the disproportionate adverse statistics when it relates to Maori but politically incorrect to do the same when it comes to homosexuals? I am not against homosexuals as a whole but object to the militants putting the whole community at risk by pushing their agenda.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/4591368a12.html

Dr may have advised HIV man safe
AAP | Saturday, 21 June 2008

A doctor admits he may have advised Victorian health authorities that a man accused of deliberately spreading HIV could not pass on the virus.

Dr Nicholas Medland made the admission during the trial of Michael Neal, 49, who has pleaded not guilty to 34 charges including infecting two people with HIV and attempting to infect 14 others.

Dr Medland told the Victorian County Court jury he wrote an email to a doctor at the Department of Human Services that may have suggested Neal was not infectious because of his successful response to HIV drugs.

The court heard Neal, of Coburg, was diagnosed in June, 2000 and was given antiretroviral therapy for HIV infection from April, 2003.

Dr Medland said the therapy aimed to reduce the level of virus – or viral loads – in an infected person’s system.

He said Neal’s viral load had steadily decreased over time until it reached its lowest level and was viewed as undetectable.

Dr Medland said via videolink the risk of transmission decreased once a person’s viral load was deemed undetectable.

Despite this, he said the risk of spreading HIV was never eliminated and he advised his patients of this.

But under cross examination, Dr Medland accepted he may have told a DHS doctor in an email that Neal’s undetectable viral load “effectively renders him uninfectious”.

Dr Medland said he did not believe he would have forwarded a copy of the email to Neal.

He also denied his aim in writing the email was to encourage the DHS to remove some of the conditions it had placed on Neal.

The court heard Neal would at times become upset and depressed at the attention he received from the DHS.

It heard Neal came to DHS attention in December, 2001 after being notified by Dr Medland .

Dr Medland said Neal gave him permission to regularly report his viral loads to the DHS to allay their concerns about his risk to the community.

Dr Medland said Neal and a man he is accused of infecting came to see him in his St Kilda clinic in June, 2001.

He recorded they had unprotected sex and the man was given post-exposure treatment for HIV.

Dr Medland said when he first told Neal of his HIV diagnosis, he would have discussed how HIV was transmitted and how to prevent its spread through safe sex.

He also said he told Neal about his legal obligation to practise safe sex or inform his partners of his HIV status.

Dr Medland said Neal was his patient from April, 1999 to March, 2006 and during that time he provided him medication for depression, HIV and erectile dysfunction.

The trial has previously heard Neal allegedly organised orgies he called “conversion” parties to infect other people with the virus.

The prosecution alleges Neal ignored health advice about his responsibilities to practise safe sex and tell partners his HIV status, instead setting out on a deliberate path to infect others.

The trial continues.
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June 21, 2008 2:23pm
JSF2008

Heres a dumb arse job . (SEXUAL OFFENDER MINDER) what do they talk about interesting job discription, ,what does a minder tells people what he does for a living, (DOSNT THIS TELL YOU GODS OWN IS FUCKED) if these kiddie attackers) need minders what the fuck are they out of restrant, ie prison or mental care, these shithead ALLWAYS REOFEND ,and ones on the loose doing what?????could this be why 40000 have said fuck nanny liarbour and moved over the ditch
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June 21, 2008 2:24pm
Barnsley Bill

http://imvotinglabour.blogspot.com/

The game the whole country can play.
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June 21, 2008 4:15pm
Whaleoil

Ghostwhodribbles can’t read. My stats on liquor outlests are not out of date. i only posted off-licence stats as that is what Clark was obfuscating about.

The stats you quote include l=on-licenced premises including restaurants and are most misleading. If you take out restaurants and still leave in bars then the stats look like this;

Ward
Clevedon On 1 Off 11 Total 12 Pop. 10,000
Howick 8 22 30 40,000
Otara 7 19 26 35,000
Papatoetoe 9 19 28 40,000
Manurewa 17 33 50 80,000
Botany 6 15 21 35,000
Mangere 6 24 30 55,000
Pakuranga 8 13 21 40,000
City Wide 62 156 218

Those are the only stats that matter as one would be hard pressed to claim drinking in restaurants is the cause of violence.

Once again with unfound acusation Ghostwhodribblesfromhisarse is wrong.
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June 21, 2008 8:43pm
philu

here is the counter to the ‘why i’m voting labour’ crib..

‘why i’m voting republican/national..’

(heh..!)

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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June 22, 2008 6:53am
philu

“..Why is Phil always going on about repressed workers, minimum wages and not enough union powers when he doesn’t work?..”

i do ‘work’..actually..s.r..

i run/edit an online news-service..

it’s called whoar.co.nz..(thanks for asking..!..)

and it is now 7.00am..sunday..

and i have been ‘up’ for some time..and have posted/linked some twenty-something news stories..

(the link to one of them i should have posted above..

http://whoar.co.nz/2008/why-im-voting-republican/

and i do this each and every day..(for the last 3+ years..)

if you haven’t been there yet..can i recommend two archive categories to start in..?

if you want to laugh/bust a gut..click on ‘humour’..

for serious/’thought-compelling’ comment/analysis/writing..

click on ‘we recommend’..

enjoy..!

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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June 22, 2008 7:01am
Manolo

Whoar said “I do ‘work’..actually..s.r.. i run/edit an online news-service.”

No wonder you’re a member of the Green party if you call that work. By the way your blog is mediocre at best, feeble at worst.

Pathetic example of the delusional state of a person ruined by excessive cannabis consumption.

On the occasion you come out of the drug-induced stupor you appear to live in, ask yourself what have you accomplished in life. Silence will be the answer.
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June 22, 2008 7:25am
philu

tho’ i am ‘deep green’..i am not a member of the green party..

and..awww..!

and..your c.v. plse..!

(mm!!..let me guess..!

i reckon you make your monies in some way from the pushing/peddling of alcohol..(a ‘drug’ pusher..as it were..)

how close is that..?..man-o-lo..?

any braindead lowlife can accumulate coin pushing drugs..eh man-o-lo..?

is that how you measure ‘accomplishment’..?

so..how are my ‘psychic-powers’ there..?..man-o-lo..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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June 22, 2008 7:58am
big bruv

philu

Lets get one thing perfectly clear here, you do not fucking work.

Working is paid employment, you steal money from me and all the other poor bastards who have money taken from them (against their wishes) every week by this corrupt government, they in turn give my money to low life’s such as yourself so you can sit on your arse doing nothing of value and setting an extremely poor example to your kids.

All I can say Phil is enjoy it while it lasts, the day is fast approaching when you and all the other thousands of bludgers will be told to fuck off by the tax payers of this country.
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June 22, 2008 9:16am
getstaffed

do ‘work’..actually..s.r…i run/edit an online news-service…it’s called whoar.co.nz..(thanks for asking)

phil, you confuse activity with work. I spend quite a bit of time riding my mountain bike. It’s enjoyable and healthy, but it is not work and neither do i expect taxpayers to make regular deposits into my bank account so that i can keep riding trails in lieu of finding a paying job.

But you do.

And it’s theft IMHO
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June 22, 2008 9:29am
philu

“..you do not fucking work..

Working is paid employment..”

that’s a very limited view of what constitutes ‘work’..there..bb..

you obviously feel that focussing on raising children ‘well’..(as just one example of many..)

..is not ‘work’..

so just that ‘opinion’ that you hold…

pretty much discounts anything else you may have to say…

(in most peoples eyes..)

..on that particular subject..

..eh..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)

btw..where’s man-o-lo..?..

collecting/counting last nights takings..?
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June 22, 2008 9:31am
getstaffed

For anyone interested, check out this exchange between phil and kimble back in 2005. Note that phil claims to be on the DPB to raise his son for ‘another year’ to ‘honour a commitment’. Actually I don’t have a problem with that…. other than such honouring becoming a convenient, indefinite lifestyle choice.
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June 22, 2008 9:48am
philu

whatever happened to ol’ kumble..?

(i heard no-one ask..)

“..former high ranking national party person..”..and all..

eh..?

him and all those (now silent/ced) other ‘snakeoil-salespeople’ of your failed/crippled/totally discredited rightwing ideologies/fantasies..

i’ve..’seen more than a few of them off.’.

eh..?

now that’s worthwhile ‘work’..!

eh..?

phil(whoar.co.nz
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June 22, 2008 10:02am
big bruv

phul

Jesus, you have no bloody idea do you?, there are millions of parents raising their kids who also hold down a job, they manage to do it yet you insist on trotting out the same pathetic excuse for stealing from me.

Do you ever consider that you are setting a poor example for your child?

And please, do not try and speak for “most people” I would wager that “most people” think you are nothing more than a thief and an extremely bad parent.
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June 22, 2008 10:18am
philu

what do all these working sole parents do doing school holidays..?..bb..?

do they park their children in those all day holding pens..?

and believe me..i am aware of the privilge i have had..as a male..to raise my children..

and um..!..any chance of moving things from the personal to the political..?

no..?

(psst..!..it just makes you look tacky/shabby/cheap/small-minded/intolerant/’nasty’/fools..

i could go on and on..eh..?..)

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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June 22, 2008 10:32am
big bruv

Phil

Those working parents find a way, they find a way like you should have to find a way, remember they are the ones who pay your fucking wages.

I would love to hear your justification for this theft (I note that you have a long history when it comes to theft) and why is it that you cannot manage to do the same as the vast majority of Kiwi parents.

Parenting is about setting an example Phil, from what you have said you fail miserably.
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June 22, 2008 10:39am
JSF2008

I thought being a sexual offender minder was the pits of a job but being philu is fucken lower down than that (whats philu job discription) do i laugh, vomit ,laugh or sigh ie another BLUDGER living on the sweat of my/ OUR collective brows 🙁
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June 22, 2008 11:38am
Chuck Bird

Phil, it appears your son was 10 when you were debating with kimble. That means he is either 14 or will soon be 14. How much longer will you use him as an excuse to live off my money? I am not totally against the DPB like others on this blog may be. I have no problem with genuine cases. Have you consider that your are making thing more difficult for those genuine cases on the DPB like mothers with three young children whose husband left for no good reason. It happens the other way around also. I know a sole father with three young children and the mother is a drug addict.

I would not step into this debate but you are one of the most obnoxious persons I have met on the blog and in person. I hope the next time there is a bloggers’ night in Auckland you do not show up at a moderately expensive restaurant and spend my and other taxpayers’ money on what is meant to be for your son. BTW – where does the money for your pot come from?
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June 22, 2008 12:03pm
Chuck Bird

I might add that when I went to bloggers’ night the year before I was fortunate enough to have arrived after Phil had left. Most of the right had also left. I was able to have a pleasant conversation with all those left who were mainly of the Left including Sonic.

Phil’s brain must still be affected by dope. Has it every occurred to him that his obnoxious behaviour does not help the cause of the Left?
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June 22, 2008 12:53pm
Patrick Starr

Phil.
I am a full time working father of a 12 year old who for the past 2 years has lived with me. Either my mother, my girlfriend or my childs mothers family looks after her for most of the school holidays. I usually take 2 weeks of my annual leave during the year to holiday overseas together.
She gets herself up and dressed off to school and I pay a retired neighbour to keep an eye on her after school. Next year my 11 year old son is going to live with me also. Prior to that I was paying over $1800 a month – plus all the trimmings as well (holidays, clothes, electronics etc)
Understandably there was a huge upset when my daughter chose to move as it meant the money flow stopped

It is entirely possible if you get off your arse and do it. I have never received any welfare but have paid hundreds of thousands in liable parent over the years (I have a 25 y.o as well)
You appear to have taken the easy option and make endless excuses, (which will be what your children learn from you)
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June 22, 2008 12:56pm
getstaffed

A quarter of NZers require state welfare.

Disgraceful.

No wonder so many Kiwis are leaving.

This Labour government has ruined NZ.
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June 22, 2008 1:05pm
philu

patrick..i have raised my son since straight after he was born..

(yep..!..cloth nappies..!..)

and may i say how fortunate you are to have family who help..

not all of us have that..

so..my question still stands..

and chucky..chucky..

you obviously really want to get ‘down ‘n gritty’..eh..?

ok..you are a reactionary creep..

your posts/comments over the ;last little while only confirm that vileness..

(i actually almost physically recoiled in horror when i saw you..and headed in the opposite direction..(didn’t you notice..?..)

um..!..shouldn’t you be in florida..?..being a seppo past it’s use-by date..and all that..?

btw..i hope you aren’t sucking up a pension here..eh chucky..?

and chucky..that you..and the other reactionary creeps..don’t ‘like’ me..

i wear as validation/cause for pride..

eh..?..

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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June 22, 2008 1:49pm
Chuck Bird

Phil, when are you going to get a job?
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June 22, 2008 2:12pm
big bruv

Phul

You obviously feel it is your right to sponge off the rest of us, I would love to hear your rational behind that line of thinking.

Do you not feel at least a little bit guilty?
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June 22, 2008 2:13pm
philu

oh look..!..we’ve come full circle..

no thanks numbnuts..

i can’t be bothered going around again..

eh..?

phil(whoar.co.nz)
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June 22, 2008 2:22pm
Patrick Starr

Philu
thats probably the only honest thing you’ve said today – “i can’t be bothered”
Kinda sums it up ….eh?
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June 22, 2008 2:47pm
big bruv

Phil

Thats no way to address your employer.
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June 22, 2008 3:02pm
Grant S

Yes Phil, you really need to get some self-respect. Jeez, when I was 17 I flipped burgers to get an income, why can’t you do the same ? Nah, I suspect you consider that beneath you, don’t you ? Which is why you pray for the continuance of the leftist-handouts you’ve become so accustomed to.

Have some self – respect.
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June 22, 2008 6:35pm
emmess

Congratulations Southern Raiders
I just heard Leighton Smith reading out part of your post on the radio
He will be reading out more of it over th enext few days
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June 23, 2008 12:11pm
Jum

Sigh

Southern Raider – Labour doesn’t want you. Your silly monologue lacks any sort of depth or serious thought and the toxic effects are too dangerous for me to stay on this site for long and discuss any that may have some merit with you.
OK just one then.

No 37 (and 40) Ahmed Zaoui can go back. Because of his religion I think he is dangerous to the future freedoms of women in New Zealand. But, then, so is National.

Is Leighton on this site looking for volunteers to push-poll before the election like he was accused of doing last election? What I would expect of a National site. No doubt Kevin Black will be trolling here next to gather brainwashed Catholic cloned drones to mantra their way around New Zealand. They are very much like the Muslims who chant and rock. Save us from National supporters and brainwashed religious chanters and rockers.

Philu
Thanks for bringing up your boy. The more men who raise children the more respect women will receive because more men will realise the job is a valuable but difficult time consuming one, which requires treating them like human beings now.

I’d be inclined to say to women who divorce – hand the child(ren) over to the man and let him learn about caring for someone other than himself, which is what is not occurring on this site. Instead we have just a bunch of misogynist, vicious, selfish (g)nat gnomes. Ignore these cretins, Philu. Carry on raising your boy the best you know how. Our taxes are with you.

The people on this blog saying that bringing up a child is not work, obviously didn’t do it or had help from a significant other.
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June 23, 2008 3:10pm
Jum

# OECD rank 22 kiwi (162)
June 20th, 2008 at 5:32 am

Boot stamping/camping is on National’s agenda, I hear.
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June 23, 2008 3:34pm
dad4justice

Dear Jum,
Haven’t you been a busy girl with all your comments over at Wisharts blog and now this big post of steaming crap.
As the father of a teenage daughter with full custody can you advise me how to keep her safe in a violent city where our young are getting slaughtered.
Kind regards
Concerned Father.
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June 23, 2008 3:36pm
Jum

dad4justice

Someone has to put a point of view that isn’t dangerous to women’s health. Also, since you were happy to visit Colin Espiner’s blogsite I gather I still have the freedom to visit here, at least while Labour is still in Government.

Your daughter – I don’t know you personally, although I know your blogging history well. Sarcasm is but one of your tools of hate.
I have to hope you are someone she can trust and rely on. In many cases it is family that is dangerous to a child’s health. Don’t bother to get emotional over that statement. We both know that families can be toxic, you from personal experience judging by your misogynist website and your letter to Key outlining your wish to see women lose any sense of equality under a National Government.

My advice – Teach her self defence because you are not there 24/7 and she is the only person left who really cares about her welfare. Also, impress upon her that women are just as important as men. She is equal and her views count just as yours do.
If I follow the thinking of the religious, radical right, women will be back behind closed doors within a flick of National getting into Government, a place where women have been before, where they have been raped, and battered and killed. As no doubt you already know, but refuse to recognise, over 90% of violence is perpetrated through domestic violence, mostly against women and often children, passively or otherwise, behind closed doors. Now it is being reported the numbers are going up. Under the jurisdiction of your beloved National/Act the numbers would go down but the suffering would continue unabated.
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June 23, 2008 4:11pm
dad4justice

I disagree Jum, as two recent surveys conducted in New Zealand showed that the perpetrators of domestic violence are equal in numbers regarding gender. Not until we eradicate ideologies and agendas will we be able to implement an early intervention service that can enable any children involved to be able to continue in a settled routine despite any conflict.

Domestic Violence is the sad scourge for society, and is responsible for so much unnecessary suffering for the children. We can fix it when we obtain gender balance and mentality from government.
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June 23, 2008 4:20pm
Jum

dad4justice
Do you seriously think we will obtain gender balance from a National Government with the only women being the welfare rottweiler and the education minister who doesn’t know about teaching and doesn’t even seem to like the job Key has given her. Still no doubt she’ll be replaced by the associate Peachey who just loves the conservative way and will privatise education into the orbit of the religious right and no doubt you will both be happy, knowing women once again are repressed into sewing and cooking and having babies. Shame about the ones who want to be scientists and PMs and professors and Doctors, as well as tailors and chefs and mothers and nurses.

Hope your daughter understands that you have little regard for her rights as a person simply because of her gender, having witnessed your unfair, biased and baseless attacks on Helen Clark. Have you asked your daughter and any other child what they want to be when they ‘grow up’. Don’t tell me. It’s none of my business. Can you be sure that the conservative right, hiding behind National, will allow your daughter and your son if you have one to realise their dreams. Don’t count on it. If I thought National would offer my son and daughter the right to live their dreams and treat them equally I would have more trust in National, but I don’t trust the people in or behind them. What if your daughter wanted to be Prime Minister. Religion does not allow that. Is that fair to your daughter?

Yes, do tell me about the strength of men and the strength of women and while we are discussing strength let’s discuss the weight applied to the hitting of the child. It’s all about strength and the abuse of it d4j. There is nothing remotely equal about the violence of men against women, and men and women against children.

What I can say about you is that you are genuine and that what you say is from the heart, which probably won’t go down at all well with the National Front who think any form of feeling is tantamount to treason. Ask Southern Raider who thinks any sort of emotion is a sign of weakness. Some useless information for you. Crying rids the body of toxins. That’s why women are so much stronger than men. At least that is one of the ways…

By the way, is sending Ahmed Zaoui back because he is a danger to women’s freedoms a pile of ‘steaming crap’? Will you tell Southern Raider or shall I?
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June 23, 2008 4:49pm
dad4justice

“Hope your daughter understands that you have little regard for her rights as a person simply because of her gender, having witnessed your unfair, biased and baseless attacks on Helen Clark.”

To my knowledge dear Jum my daughter has not called Helen Clark a “feral inbred”, unlike dear leader.
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June 23, 2008 5:07pm
big bruv

Jum

I had no idea that Labour voters where so out of touch with what the vast majority of Kiwi’s want.

By the way, you do not speak for me when you tell that drug fucked wreck PhilU that “our taxes are with you”

The rest of your “contributions” are simply laughable.
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June 23, 2008 6:30pm
Political Busker

Jum,

your commentary to dad4justice is unpleasant and as well, deeply embelished with viciousness about other’s opinions for whom you demonstrably hold no respect. How is this consistent when you suggest the primary value of your view is one of caring for others, most especially women?

Respectfully,

Benjamin Easton
(of a) fathers’ coalition.
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June 23, 2008 6:37pm
JiveKitty

Jum, your statement intrigues me. A National government “will privatise education into the orbit of the religious right and no doubt you will both be happy, knowing women once again are repressed into sewing and cooking and having babies”??? Are you shitting me? Are you seriously that ideologically blinkered that you believe a National government would move education to the religious right? You have got to be fucking joking. This current National Party is one of the more centrist National Parties in recent memory. They are not under the sway of the religious right, as you should full-well know.

I assume you believe this because at the last election they had the support of some Exclusive Brethren? Well, that issue was blown out of proportion. Yes, the Brethren are crazies, but they have a right to express their opinion just as much as any other group. They wished to express their opinion secretly probably because of the view most of society has of them, which is that they are crazies. To express their opinion, they wished to donate money to National and undertake other measures. But what people have failed to understand is that while the Brethren supported National, it is because they were seen as the lesser of two evils, rather than because they were promoters of Brethren policy.

If education was privatised, it would mean a freer market anyway. While I expect a freer market would lead to more religious based schools popping up, it is unlikely that it would be just religious based schools being created. The demand may not be there. As well as that, many religious run schools do not indoctrinate students as to those more outdated roles for women, so your belief that education would again be utilised to repress women is fairly baseless. As well as that, society would not stand for that. It would be a political death-knell if education was used in such a manner, regardless of which party in the power. Of course, people do have that paranoia of the religious right, and the belief it is much stronger than it really is.

Oh, and privatisation isn’t actually an evil thing, much as some think it is. In fact sometimes it’s a very good thing. I can’t say whether it would be in education, because I haven’t done a cost/benefit analysis, but I do know it would have some good aspects and some bad aspects. National would do their own cost/benefit analysis when considering such a policy. It seems that most seem to believe education is a public good, to a degree, anyway, and given that, it is unlikely National will move to full-privatisation.

As for “unfair, biased and baseless attacks” on women, look at your own statement. Your attacks on those two women, Judith Collins and Anne Tolley (I’ve got the right people, aye?) are pretty baseless, really. Calling Collins a welfare rottweiler is unduly harsh and implies she is a vicious dog of a woman. That’s pretty nasty. As well as this, it hasn’t yet been shown what kind of minister she will be. National hasn’t attained power yet. You also write of Tolley’s abilities without really backing up your statements. Just because she is not a teacher does not mean she will do a poor job with the education portfolio. Also, even if she does dislike her job, it does not mean she will be bad at it. Many people have jobs they dislike and are extremely good at them. Oh, and just quietly, Michael Cullen is Attorney-General, and he has no legal background. While many people may dislike the decisions he has made as Attorney-General, do you?

Also, I’m sure you can find examples supporting your claim that religion does not allow for a woman to become PM, but not all religions would prohibit it. It is unfair to tar all religions with one brush, and in all honesty extremely rude to tar all religious people with the same brush, as many religious people believe in equality. You would be offended if I said all people supporting the political party you support were idiots, I’m sure. Do not essentially do the same thing, but with a different claim, here. It is typically the fundamentalists, who are few in number and proportion, of the religions who would hold such beliefs.

You also say women are stronger than men, and imply that men cannot cry while women can? Who is applying gender stereotypes now? And if you are male, are you trying to apply a kind of reverse sexism and take on the guilt for all the oppressing men have done of women in the past, but which you obviously personally have not? If so, that is stupid. Why feel guilt for something you have not done? Or, if you are a female, why are you so sexist? Personally, I like to think men and women have leanings towards complementary, but ultimately equal attributes, and while no attribute is exclusively one gender’s, genders do have leanings towards certain attributes. But hey, I guess I’m just liberated. It’s okay; one day you might get there.
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June 23, 2008 7:11pm
JiveKitty

Oh, and emotion can be a weakness in some situations, while it can be a strength in others.
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June 23, 2008 7:17pm
big bruv

Jive Kitty take a bow, that was outstanding….but sadly wasted on Jum.
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June 23, 2008 7:32pm
JiveKitty

Thanks. Jum’s statement appeared to me, at least, nasty and illogical.
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June 23, 2008 7:58pm
Patrick Starr

Jum is an unfortunate product of our immigration service (from India I suspect) A middle aged misandrist who holds an unhealthy passion for Helen Clark, (but is even too left for Clark).
This womans an absolute fruit loop
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June 23, 2008 8:00pm
Tauhei Notts

Jum,
My wife is female. My two daughters are female. Most of my employees are female. I have a good understanding of the pressures that you are under. But don’t worry. Tomorrow, or the day after, you’ll bleed and you will feel better. She’ll be right darling.
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June 23, 2008 8:33pm
Southern Raider

Jum’s biggest problem is a major lack of a sense of humour. I thought being a Labour supporter would be just one big laugh.

Jum you don’t send your kids to Selwyn College do you?

At +36 karma points does that put me in the same league as the Dali Larma? 🙂
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June 23, 2008 9:08pm
RRM

Patrick, are you proposing that all Indians are pretty dodgy, or just most of them? Should we make them all f*ck off back home then eh???
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June 24, 2008 8:59pm
Jum

Sorry – I completely forgot to come back and check out the thread.
I didn’t realise how liberating it was to behave like the other posters on this site. I really got stuck in, didn’t I. Take a bow everyone. You taught me everything I know about attacking.

Southern Raider
And I did have a good laugh. You’re not as good as Black Books or Green Wing, but since they’re not on… I think you’re wearing your pantihose a size too small man. Oh I forgot – I was reading my Thomas More – wrong century.

Patrick Starr
Indian? I profess a respect for our Prime Minister and I’m an Indian? And you have the nerve to call me a ‘fruit loop’. Maybe the pantihose are yours, fruitloop.

Jive Kitty
I suggest you read the end posts on the following thread on Espiner’s blog; it will give you an idea of my posts when someone wants to have a serious conversation and how a final reasonable truce was arrived at, considering we didn’t agree on the subject matter:
‘Reality bites for ’smacking’ petition
Colin Espiner in On The House | 10:40 am 24 June 2008’
I believe that until women and men have an equal say in families and their children are not hit, and are given responsibility and privileges as they mature, society will not be a safe and progressive environment for all New Zealanders. Equality for women with men should be in pay, in safety and in respect for opinions, and legislate for the banning of any religious party from controlling Parliament, which will result in women not holding the office of Prime Minister. Christianity e.g. sees women as helpmates to men, not as Leaders.
‘vicious dog of a woman’ – don’t be silly. I thought more of a vicious verbal bite. She’d do well posting on here.

Religion has become far more prevalent in the media and in politics since Helen Clark became Prime Minister and was supremely successful at it – Destiny, Investigate magazine, Promisekeepers, kiwiparty, Family First.

What I would like is your view on the religions entering politics and the public eye. Do you honestly believe that they would happily elect a woman PM if they had influence over the choice. (especially a secular PM)?

Will these groups do everything they can to reverse the rights and freedoms women have at present? e.g. remember that societal and/or governmental pressure can ‘persuade’ people through financial or work or personal(banning legal abortion access) or educational sanctions to return to the home and to previously known ‘female-type’ employments. Domestically and internationally conservative pressures are coming to bear on women, as in a backlash. I would like your view on this.

Thank you.
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July 6, 2008 6:09pm

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