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September 5, 2007 7:57am by David Farrar

Breaking promises even before they are in office

Aaron has more fun from the Auckland City election regarding Action Hobson.

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Comment25

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Local Body Politics

Comments (25)

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sonic

“But not apparently being open minded on voting to help maximise benefits of council assets”

Does he mean selling the airport shares?
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September 5, 2007 8:03am
Aaron Bhatnagar

No Sonic. No-one is promising to sell the council shares. That was made absolutely clear by the Chief Executive regarding the motion proposed by the Mayor and Council officers. The motion in question was regarding a possible future restructuring of the shares to ensure Auckland City ratepayers get maximum benefit.

See the Herald – http://www.nzherald.co.nz/topic/story.cfm?c_id=114&objectid=10461536
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September 5, 2007 8:17am
sonic

” “It rules out any possibility of reducing our shareholding in whatever restructuring might take place as a result of market offers.”

So Aaron what is the difference between selling and “reducing your shareholding”?
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September 5, 2007 8:27am
Aaron Bhatnagar

Sonic – are you blind? Perhaps you need to look at what the Chief Executive said in the link I provided to you:

“”It rules out any possibility of reducing our shareholding in whatever restructuring might take place as a result of market offers.””
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September 5, 2007 8:37am
sonic

I asked you a simple question and you cut and paste the quote I’ve already posted?

I’ll ask again, what is the difference between ‘reducing your shareholding” and selling your shares.

The voters await your answer Aaron do try and do a little better this time eh?
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September 5, 2007 8:43am
Aaron Bhatnagar

Sonic, I doubt you are a voter of mine, and the question you ask about the Auckland City CEO’s quote is pointless, because neither will happen. C&R has made its position clear. No sale of the AIAL shares, but we’ll look to find ways how the shares can benefit Auckland ratepayers further.

Getting back on track, how is it one can breathlessly moot a Margaret Thatcher style poll tax and a Ken Livingstone style congestion tax for Auckland City in the same sentence in the interests of being “open minded”, but vote against ways to improve the benefits Auckland City derives from it’s AIAL shares?
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September 5, 2007 9:00am
sonic

“No sale of the AIAL shares, but we’ll look to find ways how the shares can benefit Auckland ratepayers further.”

By reducing the shareholding? Tell us again how that is not selling it?

” I doubt you are a voter of mine”

Given your performance on this thread so far that is a pretty fair guess.
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September 5, 2007 9:02am
Aaron Bhatnagar

Poor Sonic doesn’t understand that no part of the shareholding can be sold down, according to the CEO of Auckland City.
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September 5, 2007 10:46am
sonic

Well that was certainly not worth the wait.

I keep asking you to explain what “reducing the shareholding” means.

I keep getting vague and meaningless replies.

Any chance you could answer the question Aaron, or do we have to conclude you don’t actually undersatnd what your own policy means?
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September 5, 2007 11:38am
ghostwhowalks

Talking about ‘before they are in office’
Aaron has been telling international media he was an Auckland City Councillor , even before he was ‘preselected’ by the mighty wallahs at C&R.

This from the Age in Melbourne TWO YEARS AGO.

Auckland City councillor Aaron Bhatnagar launched his blog (bhatnagar.blogspot.com) in April 2004 to promote his centre-right thoughts mainly on council matters.

“I saw it as a way of helping to shape debate, as well as feeding news journalists information and commentary through a more accessible and interactive way than standard press releases,” he says. He adds journalists from mainstream media sometimes follow up on his stories.

Of course they would follow up IF he was a city councillor, but who would care if he was a nobody with a blog like 10s of millions of others.
Like any body caught out he will deny it of course, so here is the link , like a fly in the amber held for posterity.
http://www.theage.com.au/news/management-focus/storm-on-the-internet/2005/09/12/1126377241364.html

[DPF: Nice smear attempt but nowhere does Aaron say he is a City Councillor. This just shows the story mis-described him. Hell I’ve been referred to as an MP a couple of times when I was a staffer. Don’t blame the subject for a journalistic mistake.]
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September 5, 2007 11:41am
ghostwhowalks

My spies and fellow ghosts have told me earlier this year Aaron was telling a different story to local media. This time Aaron hoped a little lie wouldnt be caught out and said he was member of the Hobson Community Board which was true THREE YEARS ago before he was booted out by the voters

“Aaron Bhatnagar, of the Hobson Community Board and Orakei Residents’ Society, said “heads should roll” over the botch-up and questioned whether the council would rubberstamp the project, or subject it to public scrutiny.

“It’s sheer incompetency. This is not an isolated planning incident with all the snarl-ups in Queen St and bungles elsewhere,” Bhatnagar said.”

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/category/story.cfm?c_id=30&objectid=10429374

lets hope Aaron doesnt blame his bungle on someone else.

Maybe the voters of Hobson wont like Napoleon crowning himself well before the voters have decided

[DPF: Wow two smears in one day. Again a mistake in a story is not usually the fault of the subject.]
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September 5, 2007 11:52am
ghostwhowalks

The mists have thickened dear friends, more news from Hobson.

This from http://www.actionhobson.org.nz.

“However the domain name http://www.actionhobson.org.nz was allowed to lapse by members of the Action Hobson ticket in mid-late 2005. This was either due to lack of organisation, lack of funds, or a deliberate attempt to conceal their pre-election promises and how they have broken them.

This domain name was then re-registered by Citizens and Ratepayers Now members for the legitimate purposes of criticism and examination of the Action Hobson voting record”

How clever.. But maybe toooo clever as one page is headlined how to spot an impersonator with a image of the ‘The King’

Well we all know who the impersonator has been for the last 2 years.

Its sure to be in Herald in Sunday
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September 5, 2007 12:43pm
Right of way is Way of Right

May I act as an Interpreter.

The shareholding Held by Auckland City in Auckland Airport cannot and will not be reduced.

The REMAINING shares can be restructured in order to provide a better return for AUckland city to further benefit the ratepayers of Auckland.

Is that clear Sonic, or did I use big words again?

Try this.

Bill has shares in the airport. Bob want’s shares in the airport. Bill does not want to sell his shares, but will let Bob buy other peoples shares. Bob will then make ALL the airport shares worth lots more, which will make higher dividends for Bob, who bought shares, and Bill, who kept shares.
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September 5, 2007 12:45pm
sonic

Well Aaron certainly needs som ehelp, but if I may note.

You say

“The shareholding Held by Auckland City in Auckland Airport cannot and will not be reduced”

Aaron objects to this decision because

“It rules out any possibility of reducing our shareholding”

Some mistake surely.
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September 5, 2007 12:52pm
CraigM

Thank you RWWR !

My lord that was getting painful to follow…poor Aaron. Sonic was right in one respect, it was good test….. to see how he deals with hecklers who have no friggin idea what they are yelling about.

Nice to see sonic make a complete ass of himself for our entertainment.
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September 5, 2007 12:53pm
Redbaiter

“Nice to see sonic make a complete ass of himself for our entertainment.”

Happens so often tho that its become supremely boring….
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September 5, 2007 1:01pm
dave_c__

Isnt all this academic – If the councils retain the shares, there is no difference in owning them today than continuing to own them tomorrow.
The only gains for ratepayers are if a) they are sold at a higher price or b) dividend payments.

If they are true to their word, they should never be sold – so who cares.

I doubt if the dividends would be capable of filling more than a couple of pot holey roads
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September 5, 2007 1:32pm
sonic

Can you explain it then Craig, how he is against a measure that stops auckland reducing it’s shareholding while at the same time pledging to never reduce it’s shareholding?

It’s certainly over my head, some kind of Zen Bhuddism perhaps?

Dave, Auckland airport paid a dividend of 3.75 cents per share last year. Auckland city council owns 155.8 million shares.

Do the math.
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September 5, 2007 3:09pm
Aaron Bhatnagar

Dear oh dear, a few hours out campaigning and I come back to find mud being thrown.

Ghostwhowalks, who sounds a lot like previous malcontents Ztev and Selma, is indeed smearing. DPF is quite right in pointing out that the journalists in question got their description of me wrong. As it happens, I have been very pleased to point out I have not been any part of the council or community board for the past three years – I have no guilt by association with the lot currently mismanaging Auckland.

Sonic, I’ll spell it out clear because you appear to be terribly confused about C&R’s position.

C&R voted for the Auckland City CEO’s motion that prevents ANY amount of Auckland City’s AIAL holding being sold.

As others pointed out above, there are ways to improve Auckland City’s position, and thus increase the benefits of those shares without selling all or some of these shares.

Here’s another good example – demand a seat on the AIAL board in partnership with Manukau City. Given that both Auckland and Manukau own around 20% together, perhaps they should band together to make sure they get the most say for their shares.
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September 5, 2007 3:28pm
sonic

“demand a seat on the AIAL board in partnership with Manukau City. Given that both Auckland and Manukau own around 20% together, perhaps they should band together to make sure they get the most say for their shares.”

So why would you have to sell shares to do that, a simle vote at an AGM would achieve that.

I think you are dissembling again. You seem to want the option to sell the shares and are making up spurios reason sfor it.

One final point, asking polite and factual questions of a candidate who is asking for my vote is hardly “throwing mud” it is the essence of democracy.

I think perhaps you are a little oversensitive to be standing for public office
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September 5, 2007 3:54pm
Aaron Bhatnagar

Sonic – noone is talking about selling shares – thats the point! You seem obsessed with this. Clearly you aren’t capable of understanding what the Herald article said.

And the reference to smearing was directed at Ghostwhowalks/Ztev/Selma, not at you. I’m not sure why you thought I was referring to you, unless you are the one and the same person posting under different pseudonyms.
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September 5, 2007 4:14pm
ghostwhowalks

Thats twice that different stories just happened to say you were an elected councillor/board member.

Notice too that Aaron , was previously a Hobson community board when he lived in parnell, was part of jackie Blues campaign for Mt Roskill( I suppose you lived in Hillsborough or somewhere like that) and earlier this year Aaron had some association with the Orakei Residents Society.
But ‘this month’ Aaron is standing in Hobson. Does he live in Hobson or ‘intending to live there’. Did the journalist get that wrong too.

As for the debate over the shares, the whole thing is that C&R want to put the shares in a council owned holding company so that the directors can sell the shares to get the C&R councillors off the hook.

This is how this little scam works , make a promise which you keep, but the shares still get sold but someone else gets the blame.
The current situation means a full council meeting would have to amend a 10 year plan , which could take months.
Holding company could pass a resolution in a few days.

The previous selling of shares has cost hundreds of millions in both lost dividends and increased value .
C&R did that , the same as they sold City Design to GHD so that $90 million has been paid to consultants over the last 3 years. C&R sold off the councils own consulting arm.
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September 5, 2007 5:06pm
Aaron Bhatnagar

Ghostwhowalks/Ztev/Selma – more drivel from you. I’ve lived in Hobson ward since 1996, and never in Hillsborough, though pleased to help National in Mt Roskill in 2005, as I did in 2002. Volunteers can pick and choose where they want to help. Perhaps you have me confused with the “A Bhatnagar” who does live in Hillsborough, though no relation of mine.

The Orakei Residents Society’s membership (tasked with dealing with the inappropriate development proposed by Orakei Basin) is probably 80% Hobson Ward, with over 300 members. Your comments are from the realms of conspiracy.

And your comments over the airport shares continue into the realm of fantasy.
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September 5, 2007 5:16pm
ghostwhowalks

Come on Aaron you that this what the ‘restructuring ‘ of the shares is all about.

No comment about the selling of City Design by your mates on the previous council.

Of course some might have forgotten the big losses racked up in 2001-2 by the “the Edge” under C&R supremo David Hay

“The Edge, Auckland City’s ratepayer-subsidised entertainment business, has notched up a $4 million loss.
The financially troubled entertainment centre has had another dismal year at the box office.”

“Five employees at The Edge earn more than $100,000, compared with just three at City Design, the council’s engineering business which made a profit of $800,000 this year.”
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/1/story.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=2797122
So keep the loss making business but sell the profitable one.

Thats C&R all over
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September 5, 2007 5:40pm
george

What on earth is Bhatnagar going on about? He doesn’t want to sell the shares. But he criticises others who also don’t want to sell the shares. And then says “there are ways to improve Auckland City’s position” includign demanding a seat on the board (which I assume ACC already has), but then doesn’t explain how his opponents are stopping ACC getting a place on the board, and how his proposals would allow this.

All in all, I’m deeply confused about just what Aaron is saying. Is he saying anything? Or just making noise?
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September 5, 2007 9:01pm

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