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November 22, 2006 4:51pm by David Farrar

Investigate

The Investigate Blog says they will be breaking a major story in the near future. Hopefully not while I am on a plane!

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David C

It’ll be like…it’ll be like…five GAZILLION tons of DYNAMITE!!! Yes! Wishart is just waiting on a few key pieces of information, and…POW!!!

Or not.

DenMT
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November 22, 2006 5:34pm
GPT

And hopefully not another Pavis private life job.
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November 22, 2006 5:42pm
Darren

And what’s this about David Benson-Pope?

18R too, such a teaser.

The Secret Life of David Benson-Pope
View the breaking story here. It is R18 and hence the full version with photos needs to be purchased with a credit card for $1

Well , what would you prefer 18-rated DPB or 18-rated Peter Davis?

Either way, it all sounds like good fun.

Come on Ian, good luck, I hope it’s juicy.
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November 22, 2006 5:51pm
Darren

And what’s this about David Benson-Pope?

18R too, such a teaser.

The Secret Life of David Benson-Pope
View the breaking story here. It is R18 and hence the full version with photos needs to be purchased with a credit card for $1

Well , what would you prefer 18-rated DPB or 18-rated Peter Davis?

Either way, it all sounds like good fun.

Come on Ian, good luck, I hope it’s juicy.
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November 22, 2006 5:52pm
G

Seems to talk about Benson-Pope being a member of a S&M sex group.
Wishart will get his arse sued to hell.
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November 22, 2006 5:54pm
Mike Readman

G,

What about free speech?
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November 22, 2006 5:59pm
David C

I see I’m being punished for my earlier point on name stealing.
I’m glad I’ve made such an impression, I just wish that my imitator had a slightly better grasp of grammar.
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November 22, 2006 6:09pm
David Farrar

Somewhat depends on whether it is true or not.
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November 22, 2006 6:12pm
Andrew Bannister

This is turning into a scum-mongers war with everyone else caught in between.

Can we not do something pleasant (read unpleasant if you are Ian or Nicky) to Hager and Wishart?
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November 22, 2006 6:15pm
Andrew Bannister

… R18 with pictures and a picture of Jesus on this month’s cover.

Oh what a sad sad little man.
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November 22, 2006 6:19pm
NX

Well it can’t that Helen Clark is a corrupt bitch because that’s old news.
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November 22, 2006 6:24pm
Ben Wilson

No, I think it’s going to turn out the mayor does wear a tupee after all. Stop the press.
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November 22, 2006 6:38pm
Bruce Russell

Finally, we’ve caught up with the UK Tories in having members of government involved in proper scandals.
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November 22, 2006 6:41pm
Adolf Fiinkensein

And the Lefties all shat themselves.
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November 22, 2006 6:43pm
Fletch

I don’t think Wishart will get sued. He prepares all his stories to courtroom standard – he always has the evidence to back them up.

Anyway, read what’s on the Investigate site (click on Download Articles, and you can read a lot of the article for free). It’s shocking!!
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November 22, 2006 6:56pm
Rattus Norvegus

ummmm, wouldnt be the first politian to have his knob interfering with his brain. Im just surprised that Renee Chignall wasnt interviewed.
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November 22, 2006 7:00pm
Adolf Fiinkensein

Labour will just laugh it off and appoint the idiot Party Whip.
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November 22, 2006 7:03pm
Zutroy

BDSM play and bisexual activities. He’s gone.
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November 22, 2006 7:07pm
Fletch

For those who can’t be bothered reading, it seems BP is allegedly part of a Dunedin BDSM (bondage, discipline, sado-masochism) group known as “Southern Kinx”. That’s as far as you can read without paying because of the R18 nature.
I don’t think I’ll download it tonight – I want to keep my dinner.
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November 22, 2006 7:09pm
Adolf Fiinkensein

Will Abu Dope go before Field? My guess is he will, as Labour will perceive they have more chance of winning a by-election in Dunedin than in Mangere.
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November 22, 2006 7:17pm
RedRag

I guess the fastidious Dr Don’s “it’s my private life” defense just got caned into the weeds too.
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November 22, 2006 7:26pm
Ben Wilson

Will be interesting to see if this news leads to the kind of sympathy surge Brash got when news of his affair came out.

lol, BDSM. How silly. Who cares?
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November 22, 2006 7:35pm
Fred

Could it be…..
“NZ socialist dependent gene identified, stem cell therapy holds great promise.”
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November 22, 2006 7:38pm
Fletch

Ben *I* would care, if I had kids in his class, especially if the teacher is interested in things where people like to cause pain in others.

I think having kids standing outside for an hour in their PJs on concrete in the winter, caning kids till their bum bleeds, and walking in on girls in the shower shows at least some hints of this, don’t you think?

‘Hey, teacher! Leave them kids alone!’
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November 22, 2006 7:44pm
Murray

REALLY don’t need THAT sort of education thanks.
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November 22, 2006 7:54pm
Ben Wilson

Well, Fletch, each of those actions is entirely questionable on it’s own account, if they happened. Linking them to private sexual habits is tenuous at best. I, for instance, am heterosexual, so can it be assumed that I shouldn’t teach at a girl’s or co-ed school, as I would be leering at the girls and fantasizing about them naked?

Only people with issuez themselves care what other people get up to in their adult, consenting sex lives. I certainly find it amusing to hear about other people’s exploits, but I’m not going to condemn anything legal.
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November 22, 2006 7:56pm
David Farrar

Nothing in the article is illegal conduct, I note.

However the issue is of the public’s right to know regarding prive legal conduct. The fact that DBP was one of those who outed Don Brash’s alleged affair, and pushed that rumour, tends to diminish any sympathy for him on this issue. This is what happens when you dwell in the sewer.

Maybe Labour might want to rethink their tactics regarding Brash’s private life.
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November 22, 2006 8:05pm
Inventory2

It certainly puts a new slant on “Social Development”!! None of the MSM have picked this one up yet, but I suspect it’s only a matter of time – literally.
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November 22, 2006 8:10pm
james wilkes

Wishart’s info seems to check out. There is a Robyn Mulder who lives in Timaru and there is a BDSM group called Southern Kinx.

Is that photo (in the article) of the guy in the black cape with his knob showing Benson Pope?

http://www.southernkinx.co.nz
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November 22, 2006 8:15pm
Spirit Of 76

But in the town, it was well known
When they got home at night,
their fat and psychopathic wives would thrash them to within inches of their lives…….

Ohhh, Ohhh, Ohhh, Ohhh, Ohhh, Ohhh, Ohhh, x 2, Aaargh…….

We don’t need no education
We dont need no thought control
No dark sarcasm in the classroom
Teachers leave them kids alone
Hey! Teachers! Leave them kids alone!
All in all it’s just another brick in the wall.
All in all you’re just another brick in the wall.
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November 22, 2006 8:18pm
Ben Wilson

Keep checking it all out, guys. Try Google for more BDSM pay sites. The articles are great!
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November 22, 2006 8:27pm
Murray

Colour me surprised you’d know Ben.

Just whipping up support for the rubber wearing minority are you?
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November 22, 2006 8:41pm
Poll-driven fruitcake

Sounds like another Ian Wishart “conspiracy theory with sex” effort (remember the Air-NZ flight crew/ sex-with-prostitutes in an Auckland hotel story). He never lets a lack of facts get in the way of a story. Probably the R18 photos are so grainy, you can’t tell if it really is Benson-Pope. They’re probably out-of-focus as they may well be taken by private eye Wayne “You Can Call Me Clousteau” Idour. Why the article? Maybe Wishart is jealous that Benson-Pope is getting more sex than he is! Or maybe the BDSM Club turned down Wishart’s membership application and this is the only way he can get even?
Funny how Wishart never did an “expose” on the disgraced Graham Caphill before that cowardly, whimpering paedophile was found guilty and revealed for the hypocrite he is. Is it one “born-again Christian” trying to protect another?
“Investigate” isn’t “gutter journalism”, it’s “sewer journalism”.
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November 22, 2006 8:49pm
Murray

Instead of whining about “probably” and just dribbling on making things up yourself why don’t you read it.

General consensus is good bye the MP for K-Rd.

Make a call that isn’t based on what Helen Clark has told you to think for once in your life.
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November 22, 2006 8:53pm
spector

Classic! One of the links off the Southern Kink site is for a sister site called… wait for it… The Hollow Mens!
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November 22, 2006 8:55pm
ZenTiger

Fruitcake, Ian didn’t have to do a story on Capill because some-one else broke it first. I’ve read the full article. It raises valid points.

If David-Benson Pope is into what the witness alleges, then there is significant relevance to his position as a maker of laws and a Minister in charge of the welfare of Children, just as there was much relevance in Capill’s public role and his private behaviour.

I understand Ben Wilson’s default defence+sarcasm mode, because no-one really wants to find out about deeply private issues in this way. However, in this case Ben, I think you need to acquaint yourself with the details and then decide.

This is undoubtedly going to be hard on his friends and family as much as David Benson-Pope. Unfortunately, like Capill, there is a strong possibility this story is true.

The ball has been served. Maybe DBP can refute this absolutely, like he refuted absolutely the story of cramming a tennis ball in a students mouth. Then he misrembered.

It appears the incident was indeed, all fantasy.

It might be time for DBP to resign gracefully. Good luck Mr Benson-Pope.
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November 22, 2006 9:04pm
Ben Wilson

Murray, of course. I whipped out my card with my left hand and whacked $1 to Wishart at the mere thought that I could see DBP in rubber, um, I mean read the article and feel outraged (with both hands).
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November 22, 2006 9:04pm
Adolf Fiinkensein

If that was what he was up to at night wait until you see what was going on during daylight hours. Lots more to come , so it seems. Taxpayers funds used to pervert the course of justice, as I hear it on the grapewine. Nothing substantiated yet but don’t be surprised during the next two or thre weeks.
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November 22, 2006 9:10pm
Pascal's Bookie

If I can drag you all away from the porn for a moment, does anyone still care to maintain that Hagar and Wishart are just as bad as each other?

Hagar had plenty of Dons more personal emails and as far as we know has declined to use them in his book. What would Ian do?

The Nats have been pushing this story to journos for months. what did Judith Collins know and when did she know it? She leaked this on the floor of the house and Ian has finally run with it. 😉

(Just trying to fit in with the conspiracy mongering)
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November 22, 2006 9:10pm
Ben Wilson

Actually, ZenTiger, my sarcasm is about not wanting to find out about BDSM at all, and certainly not to pay Wishart to show me what I hear is a low quality pic anyway! Not something to spank the monkey over, even for those who are into it. Save your $1 and use Google.
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November 22, 2006 9:13pm
hisself

Interesting, Adolf…..like to spill here? Or are you too much of a pussy? All piss and wind….
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November 22, 2006 9:13pm
hisself

Interesting, Adolf…..like to spill here? Or are you too much of a pussy? All piss and wind….
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November 22, 2006 9:13pm
Adolf Fiinkensein

hisself, you’ll just have to wait and see. Oh, the agony of it all. You see, what goes round comes round, old chap. Someone shoulda told Mallard.
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November 22, 2006 9:18pm
llew

“Will be interesting to see if this news leads to the kind of sympathy surge Brash got when news of his affair came out.”

Hah! Doubt it! Nore like nausea I think.

Bring on the chief whip jokes, they’re amusing me.

Oh say (this was told me by the coroner that handled the case, believe it or not) – what were Peter Plumley-Walker’s last words?

How the hell am I going to pay for THIS?
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November 22, 2006 9:19pm
simon g

DPF said:

“The fact that DBP was one of those who outed Don Brash’s alleged affair, and pushed that rumour, tends to diminish any sympathy for him on this issue. This is what happens when you dwell in the sewer.

Maybe Labour might want to rethink their tactics regarding Brash’s private life.”

That sounds very reasonable. Except for one thing. If Benson-Pope had never said a word about ‘affairs’, would Wishart have shown no interest in this story? Was Benson-Pope only a target AFTER Brash’s personal life was alluded to in the House, by B-P and Mallard? You know the answer to that.

Their behaviour in Parliament was wrong, no question. But let’s not create a cause and effect, a spurious justification, that doesn’t exist. If Wishart had dug up something on, for example, David Parker (who nobody has ever accused of any mud-slinging), would he have acted any differently? Of course not.

Wishart didn’t need any excuse to go down in the sewer. It’s what he does.
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November 22, 2006 9:20pm
ZenTiger

I have no problem with Ian Wishart, and I haven’t read any of Nicky Hagar’s work to have an opinion about Nicky. I’m ignoring most of the comments about Nicky here UNTIL I read his book.

Most of the rants I’ve read against Ian Wishart were not based on a rational analysis of what was actually said and printed by Ian as opposed to what was implied by those in the “hate Wishart” camp.

I realise I may well be in a minority. However, if the story on DBP pans out, then Ian has a case for reporting it. If it turns out Ian’s sources are fabricating this, then I agree a simple “sorry” will not do.
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November 22, 2006 9:20pm
Raddish

Brings a whole new meaning to Liarbors “The Big Whip Around” doesn’t it!!!

So this is how they are going to PAY IT BACK!

Oh the mind boggles!!!
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November 22, 2006 9:20pm
toby1845

If DBP is involved in an S&M lifestyle, I don’t want to hear anyone saying that it is none of our (the public’s) interest. As far as I’m concerned, it is. If he is going to placed himself in – or be placed into – a position whereby he could be called upon to cast a conscience vote, we have a right to know what issues/beliefs/practices drive him.
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November 22, 2006 9:31pm
kiwi_donkey

DBP can do what he wants, as far as I am concerned, although the connection with corporal punishment and humiliation at school is a bit spooky.

But that is as a private individual. In parliament, this counts as political lying and hypocrisy on a grand scale. It really reinforces the Labour brand.

More worryingly for Labour, I think alot of their supporters will be revolted by the pledge card rort. Sorry, I meant the corrupt South Auckland MP. No, that’s not right, its the retospective legislation. Or hang on, is it bullying the Auditor General? Yes, that’s it, I’m sure it had something to do with bullying.

Poor old Helen. What will she do now? Anyway, no doubt his good mate Trevor (Heineken) Mallard will stand behind him.
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November 22, 2006 9:34pm
Mike

Give yourself a pat on the back DPF, you’re a total hypocrite.
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November 22, 2006 9:41pm
Berend de Boer

Hmmm, BPF is a pervert. Didn’t we know that already? Perfect fit for the Labour party, just in time when they’re gonna take over parental authority by repealing S59.
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November 22, 2006 9:46pm
Pascal's Bookie

Ian says “…DETAILING THE MINISTER FOR SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT’S INVOLVEMENT IN SEXUAL TORTURE SESSIONS”

This is his typical ‘ words mean exactly what I want them to mean’ style. The defining characterstic of torture is a lack of consent, if there is consent it cannot be torture. There are no ‘safe words’ in a torture session.

Ian will no doubt justify his word choice by saying that if someone who wasn’t into BDSM had this done to them it would be torture. You could use the same logic to describe missionary position sex as rape.
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November 22, 2006 9:52pm
Inventory2

Yep, there’s just a wee touch of irony there – shore up Bradford’s no smacking bill, when you’re not averse to a little bit of slap and tickle yourself….hmmmmm….

Still, I guess BP has had plenty of slave training in all the years he has been subservient to H1 & H2!!!
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November 22, 2006 9:55pm
Danyl Mclauchlan

Can those who have read the article specify if there’s any substance to Wisharts claims?
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November 22, 2006 10:00pm
Andrew

I agree with toby1845 and ZenTiger. I think our politics is sinking to uncharted depths.

There have always been Hagers and Wisharts, always will be, and they’ll continue dig, write, spin and defend. So it’s not the reporting of this kind of stuff that irks me.

For me it’s the fact that many of our key political leaders appear to have personal standards that are vastly different to my own. Where is the integrity, authenticity and strength of character? Where are the attributes of honour, pride and commitment to serve in the best interests of the country before oneself? If this all sounds too lofty then it’s because we’ve not seen this kind of leadership for so long.

How to vote? Left or right? At the moment I’m strongly considering voting with my feet.
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November 22, 2006 10:01pm
nzsyzygy

One has to wonder which way he will vote on the anti-smacking bill?
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November 22, 2006 10:10pm
ZenTiger

No Pascal. It just so happened that “Torture” was the safe word. If you focus on the trivia of the headline, maybe no-one will notice the actual content of the article?
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November 22, 2006 10:10pm
Ben Wilson

dim, I think the idea is that you have to pay your $1 to find out.
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November 22, 2006 10:12pm
nzsyzygy

One has to wonder which way he will vote on the anti-smacking bill?
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November 22, 2006 10:13pm
Pascal's Bookie

Zen,
You seem to have missed my point. I was taking about Ians deceptive style.

Ian said in the above the fold headline that BP was involved “IN SEXUAL TORTURE SESSIONS”

Nothing there to indicate that “torture” is the safe word. The syntax doesn’t work for that interpretation anyway. He is clearly, in the above the fold headline saying that BP is a sexual torturer.

If he had headlined the story ” SEXUAL ‘TORTURE’ SESSIONS”, you might have a point. Perhaps his computer ran out of speech marks, but occams razor says he just wanted to mislead.

What he says in the article itself is irrelevant.
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November 22, 2006 10:25pm
Gooner

“Can those who have read the article specify if there’s any substance to Wisharts claims?”

Danyl, you’d probably have to fork out $1, or my view is that Wishart might have the substance all hidden away as a safety net (as it were) should he get pushed too hard.
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November 22, 2006 10:28pm
Whaleoil

Having paid my dollar, I would say that DBP is a goner. It would be very hard for him to refute things like “panty slut-boy”
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November 22, 2006 10:29pm
Paul Marsden

How to vote? Left or right? At the moment I’m strongly considering voting with my feet.

Posted by Andrew | November 22, 2006 10:01 PM

Ditto Andrew. But I think the power of the internet will lift the calibre of the law makers in a very short time. (Unless of course they try to censor it?)
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November 22, 2006 10:37pm
APL

…Or the tiger balm on his knackers, or the special seat with the vibrator protruding thru the middle of it.
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November 22, 2006 10:38pm
kiwi_donkey

I’m getting a bit more worried. This group has been displaying, for its members only, a picture of a man with a swastika painted on his penis as part of a ritualistic activity.

This is a matter of considerable public interest.

The government must either deny this claimed link, or disassociate itself from this activity in the strongest possible terms. Ignoring this is not acceptable.
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November 22, 2006 10:39pm
ZenTiger

I’ve read the full article Danyl, and it mostly hinges on one key “witness”. There are elements of corrobration throughout the story. The names of people check out as existing. The BDSM club appears to exist. That doesn’t automatically mean DBP is a member.

It appears the investigator Wayne Idour found further evidence from which this sprang, and Ian covers the previous allegations about some of DBP’s school yard antics with quotes and references.

It would have strengthened the article to get corroboration on the BDSM part of the story by way of quotes from other people, rather than broader cross-references to the alleged facts presented.

None of the photos, AFAIK, are of DBP, they are just to create a visual picture to what is being read. They are not grainy.

DBP deserves the right of reply, and given the private nature of the allegations, it wouldn’t hurt for people to reserve final judgement. But to answer your question, there does appear to be some substance to the story.
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November 22, 2006 10:41pm
nzsyzygy

Andrew & Paul
With all but slightly mad Jim Anderton entitled to be in Parliament through Brady clearance, and the bullocks continuing from the illegal politicians, you have to wonder if the timing is right for a new party, possibly the common sense don’t steal from the tax payer party
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November 22, 2006 10:44pm
kiwi_donkey

ZenTiger. Bear in mind Wishart reports approaching DBP for comment, and being told by his office that he was philosophical about it, and regarded anything in Investigate as beneath comment.

Sounds like corroboration to me. It certainly is not denial.
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November 22, 2006 10:50pm
Paul Marsden

Oh how I wish! The timing couldnt be more perfect. I cannot recall such a widespread, underlying, seething contempt for the govt re this no-smacking law. Worse, National have looked a gift-horse in the mouth and barely said a word against it. Im absolutely gobsmacked.
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November 22, 2006 10:59pm
Ian Wishart

There is far more that has not been published. True to our promise to sources, we have published only what is necessary, for now.

There is a chilling tape-recorded conversation between two people, which confirms all we have published and more. This tape identifies a source and will not be released because of a serious risk to the safety of that particular source.

There is more on Benson-Pope that we have not published, plus more names and photos of other key players, some of them prominent people. We made the call that their involvement – although intimate – did not justify widening the publicity just for the sheer sake of naming them.

We have Robyn Mulder on tape, incidentally, denying any knowledge of BDSM or the Villa Cruella, until I pointed out we had photos from her website, at which point the phone line went dead.

We await whatever Benson-Pope chooses to throw at us, and fear none of it. The story is nailed down in more ways than one.
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November 22, 2006 10:59pm
james wilkes

Will the story be in Investigate this week Ian?
Will there be new material?
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November 22, 2006 11:07pm
TIC

“For me it’s the fact that many of our key political leaders appear to have personal standards that are vastly different to my own. Where is the integrity, authenticity and strength of character? Where are the attributes of honour, pride and commitment to serve in the best interests of the country before oneself? If this all sounds too lofty then it’s because we’ve not seen this kind of leadership for so long.”

In which party was there a prominent MP who has stated he wants to sweep away all morality of all sort from society?

The problem as far as DBP goes is, the argument that it’s their private life and no one else’s business – the argument long pushed. There’s been numerous allegations swirling around MPs from a number of parties.

It will be interesting to see how this is treated by Labour – since they maintain it’s no one else’s business.
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November 22, 2006 11:11pm
llew

This is very amusing, but does it constitute anything that is in the public interest to know about? Aside from the prurient interest of some.
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November 22, 2006 11:11pm
anon

I’m sorry to be the kill-joy here, but won’t everyone in Parliament (including Labour) and the mainstream media simply ignore the story as having no public interest whatsoever? In which case, the number of people who will hear about it will be in the few thousands. Or am I missing something?
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November 22, 2006 11:15pm
TIC

Seems the ODT tomorrow is going to have a bit about “further allegations against Benson-Pope”.
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November 22, 2006 11:19pm
TIC

“Oh how I wish! The timing couldnt be more perfect. I cannot recall such a widespread, underlying, seething contempt for the govt re this no-smacking law. ”

What is extremely offensive is Bradford nutting off comparing smacking to BDSM implying that it was for sexual gratification.

Well, they might know something about that on Bradford’s side of the house, it’s not reasonable to smear everyone else with their dirty thoughts.
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November 22, 2006 11:24pm
kiwi_donkey

Why is there a public interest?

– He fronted the civil union campaign because he was ‘straight’
– He helped to out Don Brash’s affair
– He holds portfolios inconsistent with his alleged preferences
– The group he is alleged to be involved with have displayed swastikas in a ritualistic fashion

Is that enough? I think denials are in order. Please.
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November 22, 2006 11:28pm
Paul Marsden

A little off topic, but nevetheless related to individual conduct and levels of standards in society.Did anyone view the police-sanctioned, anarchy by the Mongrel Mob, on TV1 news tonight? I just shook my head in disbelief and my heart sank even further for the future of this country.
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November 22, 2006 11:33pm
stanley

” – He fronted the civil union campaign because he was ‘straight'”. How does this compare to a closeted gay man who voted against the Homosexual Law Reform Act? This man has yet to be outed….

What are the inconsistencies between the alleged behaviour and his portfolios? Environment? Social Development?
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November 22, 2006 11:42pm
Russell Brown

We have Robyn Mulder on tape, incidentally, denying any knowledge of BDSM or the Villa Cruella, until I pointed out we had photos from her website, at which point the phone line went dead.

You sound so proud of yourself. If your story is correct, Ian, you have named, flouted the privacy and possibly wrecked the lives of two members of the public with no political case to answer. And just so people will recognise one of them when she goes to the supermarket, you’ve printed a large photograph of her.

I can’t see anything in your long-winded ‘Ethics’ panel that justifies that, nor in the faith you profess.

Sleep well, Ian. I’m sure they won’t.
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November 23, 2006 12:09am
simon g

Kiwi Donkey, if you’re interested in this stuff, just say so. You don’t have to invent ‘public interest’ reasons for it.

That’s no more valid than saying Brash’s personal life is relevant because of the Business Round Table link.

God, I hate seeing prurience dressed up in piety. You know damn well that Benson-Pope’s portfolios have nothing whatsoever to do with your interest.

Just pay your dollar and enjoy yourself. Skip the sanctimony.
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November 23, 2006 12:18am
Ian Wishart

And if I didn’t identify key players Russell you’d be among the first to accuse me of being short on facts.

I identified the minimum necessary.
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November 23, 2006 12:25am
Russell

Russell Brown, compare your comments re wisharts article with your opinion on your own site defending hagers right to print whatever he wants. You cannot have it both ways buddy.

lets see if your chums in the MSM and particularly the simpering one on three will give investigate the same sort of breathless wonderment reporting that they gave the wellington trustafarian hager over the last few days.
This is fantastic for all new zealanders, what will helen and helen do now to keep us sweet.
We have interest free loans working dole and plans for a billion dollar stadium already. What next a space programme?
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November 23, 2006 1:13am
Ben Wilson

Somehow I get the feeling the public is still going to be more interested in Brash. They forgave his affair happily, seeing it as a mere distraction from the truly important matter of election accounting.

Now the reverse is the case, it is he whose public life is being called into question, and a Labourite’s private life being paraded.

Admittedly BDSM is wierder than having an affair, even if opinions can differ about which one is more ‘immoral’.
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November 23, 2006 2:17am
Russell

Ben if you are questioning the morality of bdsm versus haveing an affair are you suggesting that mrs DBP is involved as well?
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November 23, 2006 3:32am
james

I agree with Ben Wilson.

A DBP story is very likely to be a red herring.

The Big Story is Mr Brash.

The political stakes are obviously higher. No international news agency/wire should carry another story about DBP. Already, though, there is international speculation that Mr Brash is a lame-duck ‘leader’ of New Zealand’s main opposition party.

Mr English will come out of all of this the strongest, I suspect. Followed, perhaps, by Mr Key.

You do the math.

Best,

James
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November 23, 2006 5:12am
ross

“Sleep well, Ian. I’m sure they won’t.”

Why, have they done something they’re ashamed of? Of course, if you’re correct and Ian has breached their privacy, we can no doubt expect an out of court settlement.
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November 23, 2006 6:37am
Murray

No james, the big story is what people say it is, not what your agenda wants to make it.

You’re pretty much going to sit there and ignore a detailed, quoted and supported presentation of information and throw all your eggs into the Hager wack job conspiracy basket.

Good luck with that but your standards of evidence are non-existent. Simply ideological partisan hackery.

If it was Brashs name instead of Benson-Pope you’d be wetting your frilly panties with excitement.
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November 23, 2006 6:53am
APL

David Ben(wil)Son-Pope !
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November 23, 2006 6:57am
dad4justice

James, when will we again arise to the stature of those that gave their lives for the freedom of this country ? Is it a mandate of a callous and diabolical bureaucratic system to make us the laughing stock of the world ?
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November 23, 2006 6:59am
kiwi_donkey

The New Zealand herald reports DBP saying he “Enough is enough. You’ve seen my diary. When would I have time for this?” he said. While Helen Clark said that the Investigate story was part of an “ongoing smear campaign”, and she would not comment further.

Do no denial then. Just spin that looks a bit like a denial without actually being one.
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November 23, 2006 7:02am
Craig Ranapia

DPF wrote:
Nothing in the article is illegal conduct, I note.

Um, I’d go slightly further. If (and please not I said ‘if’) David Benson-Pope is into S-M, I’d much rather he was indulging his sexual fetishism in private with consenting adults and doing so on his own time and at his own expense. If his wife is willing to tolerate this, that’s her business and hers alone.

Having said that, there are some people above who were quite happy to see Dianne Foreman painted as a home-wrecking whore, another woman’s name dragged through the media for the unspeakable perversion of dating Don Brash when they were both single, and Je Lin Brash’s private life subjected to distasteful public speculation by sanctimonious panty-sniffers who have the gall to look down their noses at Ian Wishart. (But are quite happy to repeat his allegation – much as we’ve seen so-called quality papers quite happy to legitimise tabloid muck by reprinting it on their front pages, while editorialising how vile it all is to cover their ethical butts.) But, of course, that was all in ‘the public interest’…

Sorry, Russell, but distasteful as I find Mr. Wishart do you seriously think the MSM has particularly clean hands?
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November 23, 2006 7:16am
Russell Brown

Russell Brown, compare your comments re wisharts article with your opinion on your own site defending hagers right to print whatever he wants. You cannot have it both ways buddy.

What on earth are you on about? Did you actually read what I wrote?
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November 23, 2006 7:20am
Craig Ranapia

Sorry, that should read:

QUOTE
(But are quite happy to repeat his allegation – much as we’ve seen so-called quality papers in the US and England quite happy to legitimise tabloid muck by reprinting it on their front pages, while editorialising how vile it all is to cover their ethical butts.)
END QUOTE

My point is that: If Investigate isn’t fit to wipe you arse with, and Ian Wishart is (to put it mildly) not one to let the facts get in the way of a good story, why the frak is the New Zealand Herald putting these latest allegation on the front page? Sorry, folks, you can’t have it both ways. And neither can you, Russell.
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November 23, 2006 7:22am
Danyl Mclauchlan

Another nice ethical dilemma for the Nats during the house today. Repeat the allegations, thus providing a desperately needed distraction from their current roles – but risk a Labour retaliation that could end the career of one of their own MPs. Tricky.

And it’s predictable but untrue to compare Nicky Hagar to Ian Wishart. Hagar announced he has decided not to publish details about Brashs private life even though he was in possession of personal emails, while Holy Ian Wishart fills his article with BDSM pictures – not because they’re specifically relevant to the story, but just so readers know what BDSM looks like.

Classy.
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November 23, 2006 7:30am
Danyl Mclauchlan

why the frak is the New Zealand Herald putting these latest allegations . . .

Another closet Battlestar Galactica fan inadvertently outs themselves . . .
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November 23, 2006 7:36am
Craig Ranapia

Daryl:

I don’t think there’s any dilemma at all. Even if the story is absolutely true (which I very much doubt), Mr. Benson-Pope’s private, consensual sexual activities with adults may be distasteful to many of us, but has nothing to do with his performance as a Parliamentarian or Minister of the Crown. (As opposed to an associate education minister facing serious and credible allegations of criminal abuse of students while a teacher; let alone the utter hypocrisy of such a man fronting an anti-bullying campaign.) AFAIC there’s no legitimate public interest, unless he’s skiving off to watch on-line B&D porn in his office, sexually harassing parliamentary staffers, or misappropriating parliamentary funds to pay for hookers and spank mags. But while DB-P isn’t exactly the sharpest pencil in the box, I don’t think he’s that stupid. 🙂
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November 23, 2006 7:48am
andrei

Mr. Benson-Pope’s private, consensual sexual activities with adults may be distasteful to many of us, but has nothing to do with his performance as a Parliamentarian or Minister of the Crown.

Wrong! The Honourable David Benson-Pope is minister of Social Development and is involved in drafting Social Policy and Laws which define who we are as a Nation and a people.

It is highly relevent what his moral character is given that the policies that he devises and supports will have a lasting impact on the cultural future of our Nation.
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November 23, 2006 7:54am
Danyl Mclauchlan

Craig,

I think the Nats are deeply uninterested in whether this is of ‘the public interest’ and will currently be preoccupied with whether it will take the heat off them for a few days. This is a presumptive sex scandal, and they know that – in theory – that trumps any other story.

The dangers are:

(a) It’s an Ian Wishart story, so possibly totally untrue. (Other members of Southern Kinks have already come forward to deny that DBP is a member).

(b) At the moment it is merely a Wishart smear. The second the National Party touch it Labour will cheerfully and loudly describe it as a National Party smear. Dangerous if it turns out to have no substance, doubly dangerous if Labour decide to use it as an opportunity to smear a National Party MP in retaliation. As we saw in the whole Don Brash v Peter Davis stories, Labours personal attacks tend to have considerably more substance than Ian Wisharts.
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November 23, 2006 8:09am
toms

You don’t have to pay money to that fucking weasel Wishart to see why he has a vendetta aganist David Benson-Pope. Its all in his first paragraph:

“In July 2004, at the height of the clash of cultures surrounding Labour’s civil unions legislation, the man responsible for ramming that law through Parliament laid down a gauntlet challenging the integrity of groups opposing him. Married, with two children, Associate Justice Minister David Benson-Pope…”

Wishart is conducting a vicious smear campaign against Mr. Benson-Pope because he sees him as responsible for getting the civil union law through parliament.

It seems no one in the media is touching this story except in the most circumspect fashion. David Benson-Pope has clearly instructed lawyers – http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=1&ObjectID=10412063 and as such I fully expect Wishart to be sued and I hope that this comments section is actionable as well.
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November 23, 2006 8:10am

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