General Debate 27 December 2016

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Biscuit

Wow, it must be Christmas! Little me is FIRST!
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December 27, 2016 8:01am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  Diminished audience due to beach cricket and other commitments at this time of year; enjoy your moment in the sun my friend
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:32am
- pdm
  
  How the hell did that happen – you are not usually up this early!!
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:48am
  - pdm
    
    Biscuit did you down tick me?
    
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    December 27, 2016 9:23am
    - Biscuit
      
      Moi?
      
      Nope.
      
      I only tend to downtick folk who say the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over (stop it there, Bisc, before you have to downtick YOURSELF)…
      
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      December 27, 2016 10:19am
Biscuit

And second…

(Will stop there. Can’t cope with more than two sets of downticks in any one day…)
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December 27, 2016 8:02am
Nostradamus

Kiwiblog has lost 3 heavy-hitters in 2016.

1. Scott Chris left the party early:

Hmm, well there you go. My last comment on Kiwiblog; excellent forum conducted by an enlightened if somewhat misguided David Farrar. Thank you and fuck you all respectively. Do your best.

2. Starboard left on his own terms:

Merry Christmas from Phuket trendsetters ! Starboard has moved permanently to Thailand ! My retirement visa came through and I can settle here until the day I drop. Feels fantastic.a lifelong dream now come true! I bid you all farewell as this will be my last post on KB. I’ve enjoyed adding my point of view over the years but now its time to close the book. Take care everybody. การอำลา

3. Then, just yesterday, Deadrightkev decided we’re not worthy of his time:

I will no longer be contributing my enormous insight and invaluable wisdom on this blog site for the foreseeable at least. The passion and hunger I once felt jousting with the political cucks and leftist morons on KB has worn off. Now that Trump has been elected I feel my work here is done. To those that share my political beliefs I salute you. I wish you all a happy new year in 2017.

So, in summary, a hissy-fit from Scott Chris, a classy sign-off from Starboard, and a self-congratulatory message from Deadrightkev. Actually, I’m not sure that Deadrightkev’s work here “is done”, which probably explains the “for the foreseeable at least” qualification in his comment. After all he hasn’t helped with the ~~formation of Fonterra~~ election of Colin Craig and his merry band of Conservatives yet!
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December 27, 2016 8:06am
- Biscuit
  
  You call them ‘heavy hitters’, Nostradamus.
  
  Me, I don’t know any of them from Adam…
  
  If I ever get so up myself in a Chat room as to say ‘I’m leaving. Notice me leaving!’, shoot me, okay…
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:11am
  - Nostradamus
    
    Biscuit:
    
    Let me introduce you to Ole Bill Mole:
    
    another day, another load of vile comments.
    Goodbye.
    
    That was on 16 December. Bill clearly had second thoughts, though, because he commented on 17 December (4 times) and 19 December (4 times). No doubt, suitably fortified with generous helpings of Christmas pudding and humble pie, he’ll be back!
    
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    December 27, 2016 8:27am
    - Ole Bill Mole
      
      In the words of the great David Lange:
      “Geoffrey, I’ve changed my mind”.
      
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      December 27, 2016 9:51am
      - holysheet
        
        In the words of moi
        “That’s a shame”
        
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        December 27, 2016 10:02am
      - mikenmild
        
        A ‘flounce’, also known as ‘leaving and never coming back’ (LANCB), often followed by a return, sometimes within minutes.
        
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        December 27, 2016 10:05am
      - Biscuit
        
        Ah, I miss DRL…
        
        Can I say that about any Labour Party leader before or since? (Short answer, two letters, an anagram of O-N…)
        
        If any of you have just under an hour to spare, have a look at this great tape of his finest moment, the Oxford Union Debate of June 1985:
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCZFPfe0LvA
        
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        December 27, 2016 10:26am
  - Ed Snack
    
    You may not know them from Adam, but I do hope that they’re better dressed.
    
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    December 28, 2016 10:29am
- nasska
  
  This may be the beginning of the end Nostra. The first two are fairly “blaah” but the loss of DRK’s opinions will rival the impact of Baity’s final, final, final departure.
  
  Will the next conservative, know-all dropkick step up to the mark? 🙂
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:17am
  - Nostradamus
    
    Nasska:
    
    I figured Deadrightkev has decided to set up a paywalled blog where uninformed sheeple like you and me can pay him for the privilege of being told we’re “political cucks and leftist morons “. Actually, on second thoughts, that sounds a bit too BDSM-like for my taste!
    
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    December 27, 2016 8:30am
    - Liberty
      
      Has all the indications of a redbaiter sock- puppet.
      
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      December 27, 2016 11:24am
  - Awww C-mon
    
    Has ‘Baity’ really departed?
    
    Sometimes I think they just want a chance to reload with a different persona.
    
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    December 27, 2016 8:52am
    - PhilBest
      
      I am guilty of having shunned KB most of the time for several years after being disgusted at the National Government Vichy syndrome following Aunty Helen’s “defeat”, and KB-ers unprincipled acquiescence in it.
      
      One contributor I miss, revisiting now, is “Redbaiter”. But did he change his ID?
      
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      December 27, 2016 9:51am
      - Kimbo
        
        My money is on the pick that you are his sock puppet.
        
        Baity – Defender of freedom and democracy, who views Singapore (!) as the archetype.
        
        Philbest – Subscribes to a clash of “reactionary, medieval, illiberal forces; versus the bloc representing the civilisational, Judeo-christian cultural inheritance” outlined by Christopher Hitchens, yet also says “I support Kissingerian realism”…for which Christopher Hitchens deemed Kissinger a war criminal.
        
        Dots. Not Connecting.
        
        Ah, but while you can’t polish a turn you can roll it in anti-PC “National Government Vichy syndrome” glitter 😉
        
        Oh, yes, and this bit of googling threw up this cuckfest from eight (!) years ago…:
        
        PhilBest
        
        I have outlined my opinion of Redbaiter along these lines before:
        
        He is a rare case of someone who is actually awake to the great “Long March Through The Institutions” of Cultural Marxism, and conducting a battle against it within the limited means available to him.
        
        I completely understand his frustration and the way it boils over into insults of those he is debating; I have been guilty of similar transgressions myself, but perhaps not as often. I am inclined to limit my name-calling of obvious leftists, to the terms of “stooge” and “dupe”, which pretty much sums the possibilities up. If someone is a “dupe”, I try and help them to see the light. If someone is a “stooge”, it is pointless trying to convert them, their role in our society is akin to that of Vidkun Quisling in Norway in 1940. All one can do is rebut their poison and alert others about the “Long March” that those people are stooges of.
        
        But as Vidkun Quisling would have deserved strong language, I think Redbaiter is well within rights a lot of time. To use a topical example, look at it this way: there would be no dead Nias and Lillybings and Kahui twins, without that damned, abominable, satanic, “Long March”. If you still make excuses for welfarism and soft treatment of criminals and victim culture ideology, you deserve anything Redbaiter calls you.
        
        …November 24, 2008 7:34pm
        
        http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2008/11/general_debate_24_november_2008.html
        
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        December 27, 2016 10:00am
      - mikenmild
        
        Nice research. Nostradamus, the resident archivist, will be proud of you.
        
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        December 27, 2016 10:09am
    - Kimbo
      
      @ mikenmild
      
      Nice research. Nostradamus, the resident archivist, will be proud of you.
      
      It wasn’t that impressive
      
      Visceral right winger who makes it sound like he personally fought against Castro’s Cubans in Angola c1975, who ropes in Christopher Hitchens as a supporting source for the “Judeo-christian cultural inheritance”? Christopher Hitchens?!
      
      Someone has been eating the crayons, rather than using them to connect the ideological dots in a coherent and non-contradictory fashion.
      
      ~~Can only~~ Likely to be one guy. Welcome back, Baity.
      
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      December 27, 2016 10:14am
      - PhilBest
        
        That is an impressive achievement for “Baity” if somehow he was maintaining two KB identities who talked to each other for years.
        
        I still stand by the comment I made 8 years ago. You’re the kind of person it is directed at, so if you don’t like it, that is a confirmation.
        
        You are taking my references to Hitchens out of context. I merely regard him as consistent, unlike most people on the left. He did not come out supporting militant Islamists as “the enemy of my enemy”, or supporting multi-cultural PC pandering in the west itself. Like most leftists, he regarded himself as a child of the Enlightenment, but unlike most other leftists, he did not act as a Quisling on behalf of medieval anti-enlightenment cultures and the associated ancient imperialism trying to get out of its box.
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:25am
      - Kimbo
        
        That is an impressive achievement for “Baity” if somehow he was maintaining two KB identities who talked to each other for years.
        
        Given the number of voices that have gone to die in Redbaiter’s head, maintaining two interacting personas in a public forum would be easy. 😉
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:32am
      - PhilBest
        
        And I pick you, Kimbo, as Redbaiter doing “false flag” comments to make the left look bad… an incredible guy, that Redbaiter, anything is possible…
        
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        December 27, 2016 12:44pm
- Happychappy
  
  Wow he has obviously a high opinion of himself and here was me thinking the majority of those that posted on KB were astute and humble people.
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:36am
- dime
  
  Enjoy life starboard! Sounds glorious
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:42am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  I will miss the little pony and trev when they sign off; Trev will leave when he figures out that his non-de-plume is blown or when he is handed his arse card and has to be here on his own time and no longer on my dime
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:49am
  - mikenmild
    
    The notion that MPs would bother commenting here under noms de plume says something about the ego of those fuckwits who imagine that it might be true.
    
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    December 27, 2016 9:33am
- KevinH
  
  Starboard has finally found a nice lady boy to settle down with in Phuket.He will be back in God zone for treatment hehe.
  
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  December 27, 2016 10:17am
- Fletch
  
  So this is kind of a like a ‘celebrities we lost in 2016’ comment? 🙂
  
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  December 27, 2016 10:25am
  - PhilBest
    
    Nah, it’s “fake news”…. 🙂
    
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    December 27, 2016 11:27am
- thedavincimode
  
  … and in the same spirit of unbounded self-importance demonstrated by scotty wotty and drk, I wish to announce that I’m not leaving.
  
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  December 27, 2016 11:43am
  - Kimbo
    
    Glad to hear it – and uptick from me at that good news. No, that is not sarcasm. Need the likes of you to keep us BA-and-other-useless-as-shit-weet-bix-card graduates from getting up ourselves. 😉
    
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    December 27, 2016 11:47am
  - mikenmild
    
    I too, pledge to remain, along with all my aliases.
    
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    December 27, 2016 11:55am
    - thedavincimode
      
      So far, there are 5 people who need to get a life.
      
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      December 27, 2016 6:04pm
- starboard
  
  Thank you Nosty…should you ever find yourself in Phuket, head to the Freedom Bar at Rawai Beach.
  There you shall find me supping on a beer Chang most nights after 1700.
  Ask for Johnny. I’ll shout the first round.
  
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  December 27, 2016 2:36pm
  - thedavincimode
    
    Vaya con Dios starboard. Don’t forget to give milky’s mum one before you leave.
    
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    December 27, 2016 6:00pm
- EAD
  
  Thanks for the info Nosty. Very much an all seeing eye!
  
  Of all those, Starboard was the biggest loss – I really enjoyed his antidotes from his travels through Thailand.
  
  DRK started off good, but I think certain posters riled him up a bit and caused him to lose all sense of perspective 🙂
  
  Some other posters who I made a point of reading (for various reasons) but haven’t seen for a while:
  – Kea
  – wikiwires business
  – Icarus
  – Sean Herles (Him and I had some mighty clashes!)
  – Ugly Truth (although I’ve seen him pop up in Pete Georges Yawnz)
  
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  December 27, 2016 3:38pm
BarryB

I see that Uber has thumbed its nose at the California law – a rule that is about self driving cars.

I am both amazed and concerned at the attitude that Uber seems to be taking all over the world. Here in NZ they refuse to comply with the law about ‘P’ emdorsed licenses for their drivers.
And whats worse the Government seems to be doing nothing about it.

In the UK they are defying a tribunal ruling, In france the government there has at least taken action with a criminal charge, in India they have somehow avoided a rape charge by one of their drivers
and in the US (besides the California situation) they are ignoring rulings in New York and some other state.

I am wondering if this is a harbinger of what the TPPA would bring to our shores.
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December 27, 2016 8:10am
- Pateke
  
  It’s the new post-law age, just like Trumps post-truth. You just say it or do it anyway and then wait to see if anyone does anything about it it. No? Ok then, carry on.
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:17am
  - Paulus Gnome
    
    I’ll go with that; light blue touch paper, retire to safe distance . . .
    
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    December 27, 2016 8:37am
  - cmm
    
    You started out with a very inciteful comment then screwed it up by trying to twist it into a Trumpist rant.
    
    Yes we certainly have entered a time where the law is being applied irrationally.
    
    There has always been some discretion in the application of the law. Police would routinely apply common sense and issue warnings or turn a blind eye when they knew no problems would arise.
    
    Now things have flipped the other way: the people being let off are increasingly those that need the guidance the law gives.
    
    Laws seem to no longer be applied on an equitable basis, but rather on the basis of what is popular or politically astute.
    
    Uber should be held to the same standards as taxis. eg. If taxis must have P endorsements and commercial insurance, then Uber must have the same.
    
    One caveat to that though: it would be better to take a step back from actual regulations and look at the goals of the regulations. If Uber can satisfy those in an alternative way then there would be no reason for the P endorsements (but then taxi companies should also have the same opportunities available).
    
    For example, the purpose of a P endorsement might be to ensure that the driver has really good skills and that they have not been collared for drink driving in the last 5 years etc. If Uber (or other transport providers) can ensure that, then they should not need P endorsements.
    
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    December 27, 2016 8:40am
    - Disaster Area
      
      ‘One caveat to that though: it would be better to take a step back from actual regulations and look at the goals of the regulations. If Uber can satisfy those in an alternative way then there would be no reason for the P endorsements (but then taxi companies should also have the same opportunities available).’
      
      This is exactly what Uber are doing: They claim that their systems are better so there is no need to follow the law. I think that there is a difference between a company deciding that it ‘satisfies’ but doesn’t follow the law and the Government realising that a law needs repealed or amended to suit new situations.
      
      Part of me wonders if the ‘maverick’ and ‘groundbreaking’ spirit of some of these start-ups has changed into a ‘we can do what we want’ attitude.
      
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      December 27, 2016 9:37am
  - kowtow
    
    A bit like Merkel breaking the law allowing one million third worlders into Germany and then when they rape and bomb having second thoughts about it?
    
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    December 27, 2016 9:45am
    - stephieboy
      
      Breaking what law and whose ” they ” ? Everyone of those “one million ” third worlders ?
      
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      December 27, 2016 9:53am
      - pentwig
        
        ffs
        go back in your pond daffy
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:31am
      - mikenmild
        
        Will the day ever come when pentwig makes a comment of any substance? Mindless abuse has its place on Kiwiblog, of course, but there is so much more.
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:35am
      - thedavincimode
        
        Mindless abuse has its place on Kiwiblog, of course, but there is so much more
        
        Such as?
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:47am
      - mikenmild
        
        The reasoned social commentary of harriet, Beesting and D4J.
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:58am
      - Kimbo
        
        And the thigh-slapping humor of dime, Sir Cullen’s Sidekick and AgentBallSack.
        
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        December 27, 2016 12:00pm
Andrei

Christmas in Aleppo
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December 27, 2016 8:19am
- BeeSting
  
  Feel the REAL Power and Get used to it.
  
  Christ Fights you with Trumpets and Santa Suits.
  
  There is nothing and I mean nothing in this world
  or the next you or anyone can do to defeat us.
  
  Do not think this battle is over.
  
  Very Soon a New one a Real one Starts.
  
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  December 27, 2016 10:40am
  - mikenmild
    
    Fucking loonies.
    
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    December 27, 2016 10:43am
  - stephieboy
    
    “Do not think this battle is over.
    
    Very Soon a New one a Real one Starts.” ?????
    
    https://i.ytimg.com/vi/48lHKizta1I/maxresdefault.jpg
    
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    December 27, 2016 10:45am
    - Andrei
      
      Lol Stephieboy thinks Donald TRump is the Anti Christ
      
      What a loon!
      
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      December 27, 2016 11:41am
      - BeeSting
        
        Most Muslims do realise when the Loonie Tunes have finished their war on Christianity
        and White Europeans.
        
        Give the World 7 Days without the Benefit
        of Christian Civilisation.
        
        And these Nut Jobs will have the World Burning in an Eternal are we allowed to say it
        
        Eternal Nuclear Holocaust
        
        The People who are Driving Vans saying
        Alla Snackbar? which sometimes are not “Muslim”
        which translates to “My Brakes are not working”
        
        Are very soon going to have dirty Nukes and all sorts of other nasties.
        
        The Syrians to their Credit are moving Heaven
        and Earth to Save their Christians
        
        Just had a taste of the opposite and they
        DO NOT LIKE IT
        
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        December 27, 2016 9:45pm
- cha
  
  Christmas in Beirut.
  
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  December 27, 2016 11:20am
- cha
  
  Christmas bagpipes in Beit Sahour.
  
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  December 27, 2016 11:29am
  - Andrei
    
    The pipers are Orthodox Christians Cha
    
    Bill Clinton murdered Orthodox Christians in the Balkans and the Americans are murdering them today in Ukraine with their Fascist uniate proxies
    
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    December 27, 2016 11:45am
    - stephieboy
      
      Andrei , Bill Clinton murdered Orthodox Christians in the Balkans etc
      
      Blatant untruths !
      
      https://theyorkhistorian.files.wordpress.com/2015/09/komsomol-generation.jpg
      
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      December 27, 2016 2:45pm
    - cha
      
      I do believe that’s what it says on the box, Andrei.
      /
      
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      December 27, 2016 3:34pm
Happychappy

Is Labour and Andrew Little delusional or are they just plain thick.Little and his bunch of out their used by date MP’s are helping the media make it look like Labour are streets ahead in the race to be the Government in 2017.In the lasest interview the Labour Leader is stating that they won Mt Roskil because of the housing crisis not because they owned the seat or because their seat had a 15000 Labour majority, no Andrew a his merry men think it is because they made housing the topic that will win Labour power. Any person that doesn’t think that housing won’t play a part in the next general Election would be dreaming but all the house and property Millionaire’s around NZ will have more say than Little’s pimping the poor and will not give Labour or the Greens the power to take away their new found wealth.
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December 27, 2016 8:23am
- Paulus Gnome
  
  Will be interesting to see if labour pimp housing as the lead moan in Mt Albert given that they ‘own’ that seat more conclusively than Mt Roskill and have held the position since the formation of the electorate.
  
  How will they explain the ‘housing crisis’ in the electorate as they have been in government and did not ‘solve’ the crisis for the good burghers of Mt Albert then?
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:43am
  - PhilBest
    
    And the Council, which is responsible for the policies causing the crisis, is wall-to-wall Labour / left anyway.
    
    Aunty Helen certainly enabled them and the problem started on her watch. But the Vichy National government of John Key has just held the policy course “steady as she goes” even as the problem has gone to Kafka-esque new heights. And one would have thought that a political party of “the right” would have had a few clues regarding the general principles – eg central planning doesn’t work, the market isn’t working because of regulatory interferences in it, etc. Don Brash in 2005 was the real deal.
    
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    December 27, 2016 9:56am
    - Paulus
      
      Heard of possibility that Helen you know who will be back next year to be chief of Auckland University to take it much further to the left if that is possible.
      Nobody else will have her – not her so called husband either. Pity he could not go to the US to see her – wot no visa ?
      
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      December 27, 2016 10:49am
- cmm
  
  Housing is a big deal in luvvie-town (Labour, Greens, John Campbell etc).
  
  But for Joe average the issue is getting really tired. Most people working hard and responsibly to pay off their mortgages are feeling increasingly hostile to the people who take their taxes then complain they are not getting enough.
  
  Labour is no longer Labour. They don’t care about people who work. They care about (or are at least pimping) the bludgers.
  
  That’s a really dopey strategy for Labour: there are very few bludgers and they have a really love voting %.
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:48am
  - artemisia
    
    Yes, and how about the numbers of first home buyers making their first purchase every day of the week. And those trading up in the same market.
    
    Those FHBs are more likely to be DINKs delaying their first baby until they are settled or at least on the property ladder. They will be the ones working long hours, two jobs, living frugally, beefing up Kiwisaver, starting on one of the lower rungs of the ladder. A studio apartment where they plan to pay down the mortgage fast (more long hours of work and frugal living), or a little do up in a down at heel area.
    
    Then there are the unskilled or those with media degrees, looking down the barrel of low income for years. Or the ones who didn’t figure out contraception in time. Or the ones with the OE behind them. Or the ones with all the toys.
    
    The first lot don’t need government help. The second lot need to earn it first.
    
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    December 27, 2016 9:06am
    - Happychappy
      
      Maybe they should look up the meaning of these words,responsibility and work. How do you think people survived in the 1940’s to the 70’s and a lot of families had up to six children.
      
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      December 27, 2016 9:18am
      - PhilBest
        
        Remind us how much a section for a new house cost in real terms back then.
        
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        December 27, 2016 9:58am
      - Harriet
        
        “…..responsibility and work…..”
        
        Couples with children no longer ‘earn’ a family income between the parents doing two jobs, instead the ‘balance’ is made up by WFF payments.
        
        It’s not parents or employees who are at fault, but that of government and employers. Employers are acting like children, they need to pay real wages that can help sustain a family.
        
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        December 27, 2016 9:59am
      - cmm
        
        “The meaning of these words,responsibility and work”
        
        And gratitude, modest, budgeting,….
        
        Those large families in the 1950s considered themselves fortunate to live in single glazed, uninsulated unheated houses that today’s entitled beneficiaries say are unfit for human habitation.
        
        Three kids in a room – no worries.
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:30am
      - Viking2
        
        PB.
        Even if you wanted to there are few places you can put a Keith Hay or similar or even a good second hand house.
        Reason is covenants. The your not going to plonk one of those among all our flash houses syndrome.
        
        Unless or until someone will create a subdivison allowing these buildings then housing will continue to be expensive.
        
        I see daily houses that are huge, built on lifestyle blocks, (all work for the weekends IMHO), houses that have 4 or more bedrooms and are occupied by two people.
        
        One of the drivers of this are people who have owned property in Auckland and come to the BOP with a dollop of cash, don’t care what they spend. There is a Retirement Village not far from me where the houses are huge and the cost is well up there. Can’t make enough. Dumb really given the loss incurred and that these places are not family friendly. Can’t keep you kids or grand kids there.
        
        The other driver is that when people die leaving estates of considerable value, say 3 $4 million or more then the kids inherit and splash out on these flash houses. Their money but its a big factor in our market and has been for about 10 years.
        
        Bob Clarkson wanted to progress a big subdivision on the which he was going to build cheap houses. Council stonewalled him in favour of others. He has now sold that land to another company and it won’t be started for another 5 years.
        Did our previous Mayor give a stuff. Nope. To much vested interest for both the cpuncil and others. Thankfully he is no longer the lazy Mayor.
        
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        December 27, 2016 12:54pm
    - PhilBest
      
      The problem with all that “good old days” stuff, is that things are totally different in the urban land market now. The fact that FHB’s could once consider a brand new Keith Hay home, or an old-suburb fixer-upper, was that in both cases, the land was cheap.
      
      The new Keith Hay home would cost around 2.5 times your annual income and the section around 0.5 times, making a total of around 3. The old-suburb fixer-upper would cost around 2.5 times your income for the section, being in a more valuable location, and the dump of a house would cost 0.5 times, making a total of around 3.
      
      Now the options look like this: el cheapo new townhouse for 2.5 times your income on a pocket-handkerchief piece of dirt that costs 5 times your income, making a total of 7.5 times your income. Old-suburb fixer-upper for 0.5 times your income on a section 15 times your income, making a total of 16.5 times your income.
      
      Most people taking a Marie Antoinette attitude, just aren’t looking hard enough at the realities. This is the stuff of mass delusions and manias and it will end the same way they all do.
      
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      December 27, 2016 10:05am
      - Don the Kiwi
        
        I can remember when 1/4 acre section in Papamoa could be bought for 50 Quid. (early 1960’s)
        That same section now is cut in half, and each half sold for $800,000 – and if it is within sight of the beach, nearly double that.
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:07am
      - artemisia
        
        That loan to income stuff depends on income levels. Average prices compared to average incomes is only one way of looking at the story.
        
        First, what measure of income is being used – individual or household? Including all ages or working age, 16 – 25s who are students or minimum wage?
        
        More importantly, look at median house prices (rather than average, which are easily skewed). What median means is that half of values are at or below, and same above. That is big numbers each side of the median. How about measuring working age household income in the demographic likely to be thinking about buying. So, not 16 year olds then.
        
        As at 30 November median prices of actual sales –
        
        Auckland $851,944
        All NZ$520,000
        Wellington (for comparison) $500,000.
        
        So – half of all sales in NZ in November 2016 were under $520,000.
        
        OK – lies, damn lies and statistics PhilBest. But at least I have presented some data which uses median actual prices.
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:08am
      - stephieboy
        
        Don the Kiwi, a mere supply and demand issue at Papamoa ?
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:32am
      - PhilBest
        
        Do you think I’m not up to speed with all that, Artemisia? It doesn’t matter how you measure it, things have got worse.
        
        The fact that the inflation is all in land prices, makes it complex to do apples-for-apples comparisons between “houses” and their potential buyers, at different points in time. I respect Demographia’s “median multiples” for definitely showing that there is a problem, but median multiples using household income (as they do) understate the scope of the problem.
        
        “Household income” back in the 1960’s usually meant a single breadwinner, yet the median multiple was typically around 3. For the median multiple to be 10 in Auckland and 6+ everywhere else (except rural towns) in the face of a dual-income norm, obviously is an even bigger problem than the change in the multiple itself, would suggest.
        
        Add to this, that everyone at every income level who is actually getting into the market somehow, is making massive “Hobson’s choice” trade-offs to do so, compared to their equivalents in the past. As I said, you could once expect to get a Keith Hay home in a new fringe suburb, or you could get a fixer-upper near the CBD, for around the same affordable price (and on a single income). Now it is necessary to sacrifice space, newness, quality and location; and end up with the worst of all worlds. Massive debt which will be still a significant burden in 10 and 20 years time; lack of space; lack of privacy; repairs and maintenance needed but no spare money to do it; monster commutes; unhealthy living conditions, etc etc.
        
        I don’t know what direction you think the “use of statistics” distorts this argument; I say almost no statistics express the real magnitude of the problem, and the best one is probably that the real price of urban land is up 1000 to 3000 percent. And “land” is like the ultimate decider ingredient in “housing” like wheat is in bread. You could try and minimise the impact of wheat price increases by saying that “the price of loaves of bread being traded are really only about twice what they used to be”, and ignore that they are 1/3 the size, padded out with sawdust, and weevily; and ignore that some proportion of the population isn’t even buying them at all because they can’t afford them.
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:48am
    - Viking2
      
      3000.00 pounds and pay was 20 pounds a week.
      a week.
      Tax I can’t remember but it was fairly high.
      Couldn’t buy a new car without oversea’s funds.
      
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      December 27, 2016 12:40pm
jcuk

The wishful thinking both here with Happy Chappy and over at The Standard is amusing 🙂

Best to everybody for 2017, especially DPF and the babe.
13 5
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December 27, 2016 8:41am
dime

Dime just finished his morning beach walk. Might have got burnt already. Yikes.

Great summer weather
10 3
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December 27, 2016 8:43am
Reid

Clinton’s fallout is interestingly causing an internal revolution among Hillary’s big donors. At her New York bash to “thank” her big donors of $1 million or more, she took no blame and pointed the finger at Comey and Putin. Her spin did not work and she has lost a lot of credibility according to confidential sources. They were smart enough to realize that even if Russia “hacked” the DNC and Podesta emails, there would be no release if there had been no wrongdoing to begin with.

Now Clinton’s biggest backers want a “campaign autopsy,” which could expose Clinton’s entire operation. The donors are demanding to know where Clinton spent the near $1.5 billion in campaign resources she collected in the closing months. They want the receipts. They are demanding an honest investigation of how Clinton failed to read the mood in swing states and how her Brooklyn operation misread polling data.

The donors are not buying the Russian hack story. Putin isn’t the only explanation for her failure and they are now pointing the finger at Hillary. She never bothered to go to Wisconsin. The story running behind the curtain is that fundraisers are cutting off all donations to the Democratic Party until this honest review is carried out. They do not want to hear about Comey and Putin…

https://www.armstrongeconomics.com/international-news/north_america/2016-u-s-presidential-election/clinton-donors-want-to-investigate-where-hillary-spent-1-5-billion-for-her-campaign/
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December 27, 2016 8:53am
- holysheet
  
  Were is Stupidboy and all you other snowflakes when killary needs you. Like rats who have deserted the sunken ship SS Clinton, nothing will be said anymore. What can they say except Waa Waa Waa we was robbed.
  
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  December 27, 2016 9:28am
  - Disaster Area
    
    Alas we will never get to see how magnanimous and dignified Trump would have been if he’d lost.
    
    At least all of those Second Amendment Types can stand down for four years.
    
    5 11
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    December 27, 2016 9:41am
  - stephieboy
    
    holyexcrement , just imgaine if things gad been on the other foot. Trump and his Trumpunzees would of escaped from their zoos carrying out an insurrection ,
    
    https://s.yimg.com/os/publish-images/movies/2014-07-17/bbfb9bb0-0e0d-11e4-bf7c-07138289bf59_dpa_1366x768.jpg
    
    2 21
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    December 27, 2016 10:05am
    - pentwig
      
      fool
      
      10 4
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      December 27, 2016 11:37am
      - Gabby
        
        merkin
        
        3 10
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        December 27, 2016 12:39pm
- Paulus
  
  Obama is now saying the he would have beaten Trump which does not say much for Hillarious.
  
  Mrs Obama is getting personally very nasty – a side which has not shown often !
  
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  December 27, 2016 10:52am
  - holysheet
    
    Snowflakes are like this. While things are going their way, they are sweet and nice. Once things change against their will the gloves come off and we see the real person. You can take the chimp out of the jungle, but you cannot take the jungle out of the chimp.
    
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    December 27, 2016 1:37pm
- Viking2
  
  President Barack Obama said in an interview released Monday that he would have beaten Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump “if I had run again,” delivering an implicit criticism of Hillary Clinton’s campaign, which he said acted too cautiously out of a mistaken belief that victory was all but certain.
  
  “If you think you’re winning, then you have a tendency, just like in sports, maybe to play it safer,” Obama said in the interview with former adviser and longtime friend David Axelrod, a CNN analyst, for his The Axe Files podcast. The president said Clinton “understandably . . . looked and said, well, given my opponent and the things he’s saying and what he’s doing, we should focus on that”.
  
  http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/us-election-2016/87960661/president-obama-says-he-would-have-beaten-donald-trump?cid=facebook.post.87960661
  
  What a pair of losers.
  
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  December 27, 2016 12:57pm
- RF
  
  The wicked witch / bitch Clinton is in deep shit as her donors are demanding answers not red herrings such as Russia hacked it.
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:40pm
Stars And Stripes

Why you need to meet a refugee
http://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/well-good/inspire-me/85593612/murdoch-stephens-on-doubling-nzs-refugee-quota.
“Failing that, Murdoch Stephens recommends going out of your way to meet a former refugee.
“Getting to know people from refugee backgrounds helps us to avoid romanticising or demonising their lives,” he says.
“I’d hope that would lead to a more robust public discussion on what a fairer refugee quota should be.”

Some more wish washy crap from Murdoch’s bleeding heart.
However he may get his wish soon because if the current immigration policy of flooding the country with all comers is pursued for another 10 years or so we will all be refugees in our own country so finding someone to have a chinwag with should not be difficult.
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December 27, 2016 8:53am
- MT_Tinman
  
  I’ve met a few of these refugees Murdoch Stephens is talking about.
  
  To a person the ones I’ve met have been bludging, dishonest scum.
  
  Murdoch can both keep them and pay for the bastards!
  
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  December 27, 2016 9:31am
- Harriet
  
  “Getting to know people from refugee backgrounds helps us to avoid romanticising or demonising their lives,” he says.
  
  Yep. The Jews leaving Europe for Israel are essentially refugees – but Stephens won’t mention that!
  
  Just more anti Christian and anti Jew crap. 😎
  
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  December 27, 2016 10:09am
Nostradamus

The downside to Twitter diplomacy:

1. AWD News publishes a story:

The former Israeli Defence Minister has threatened to “destroy” Pakistan-after Pakistan said on Thursday it will send Sunni fighters to Syria.

2. Pakistan’s defence minister Khawaja Mohammad Asif tweets:

Israeli def min threatens nuclear retaliation presuming pak role in Syria against Daesh.Israel forgets Pakistan is a Nuclear state too AH

3.Israel’s Ministry of Defense responds:

The statement attributed to fmr Def Min Yaalon re Pakistan was never said

reports referred to by the Pakistani Def Min are entirely false

4. Western media, including The Guardian, describe AWD News as “a fake news site”.
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December 27, 2016 8:59am
Inandout

Obama now says if he had run again he would have won. Thank God he couldn’t.
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December 27, 2016 9:04am
- cmm
  
  The world’s greatest gun salesman is fully deluded.
  
  28 2
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  December 27, 2016 9:08am
  - stephieboy
    
    cmm , as Omar Mateen would of fully appreciated when he purchased his armoury casually over the counter at a local gun store .
    
    A SIG Sauer MCX semi-automatic rifle and a 9mm Glock 17 semi-automatic pistol.
    
    The joys of lax gun controls. Kids, teachers now will be able to casually carry them at schools and campus etc
    
    Thanks Thwump !
    
    1 19
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    December 27, 2016 10:12am
    - Don the Kiwi
      
      Idiot – the guy had a security clearance which meant that he did not need to be checked.
      The Obama administration gave him the clearance – blame the stupid Obummer – he is in the same ‘stupidboy’ class as you.
      
      10 3
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      December 27, 2016 11:13am
      - stephieboy
        
        Don the Kiwi, the facts are according to this report Omar Mateen walked into a gunstore 10 days prior .,made his purchase and no questions asked,
        
        “Orlando Shooter Bought Gun Legally, Store Owner Say”
        
        http://time.com/4367592/orlando-shooting-gun-store-owner/
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:45am
      - All_on_Red
        
        From Stephies link…
        ‘passed a thorough background check.’
        So Stephie saying ‘no questions asked’ is clearly a lie.
        
        8 2
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        December 27, 2016 11:49am
      - stephieboy
        
        All on Red , background checks ??
        
        “What is the Terror Gap? The federal government currently has no authority to block firearm sales to international or domestic terror suspects. This gap in our laws is a glaring public safety concern, as DOJ remains powerless to stop individuals on the terror watch lists from getting armed—even though many are considered too dangerous to board a plane….
        
        The gun lobby has fought efforts to close the terror gap: Since 2007, the National Rifle Association has blocked efforts to keep guns out of the hands of suspected terrorists, opposing numerous bills seeking to close the terror gap.1
        Documented purchases: According to the Government Accountability Office, individuals on the terror watch lists tried to buy guns and explosives 2,233 times between February 2004 and December 2014. On 2,043 occasions—91 percent of such attempts—the FBI was unable to block gun and explosives sales to suspected terrorists.2”
        
        https://everytownresearch.org/closing-the-terror-gap-in-gun-background-checks/
        
        Thanks NRA and their swarmy apologists like Don the Kiwi and you !
        
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        December 27, 2016 12:07pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Lol at the wriggling being done by the liar who got caught out.
        So funny. When your own links contradict your own claims! You’re not very good at this blogging huh
        You going to retract?
        
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        December 27, 2016 12:10pm
      - stephieboy
        
        All on Wed , no wriggling .Simply pointing out why background checks did not reveal anything about Omar Mateen.Thanks to the machination of the NRA and gun lobby in whom Trump and his supporters ( like you ) favour rests !
        
        Why should I retract precisely ?
        
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        December 27, 2016 12:29pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Still wriggling about being caught out lying.
        You said ‘no questions asked’ when your own link said ‘passed a thorough background check’so pretty obvious questions were asked.
        You should retract your claim ‘no questions asked’
        You’re either thick or a liar, oh dear, probably both!!!
        Have to say, it’s funny to watch. I’ve lost count of the times your own links contradict you. You keep getting caught out, yet you still continue to do it. Hilarious.
        
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        December 27, 2016 12:37pm
    - stephieboy
      
      All On Red , Ok a background check that revelaed nothing thanks to the Terror gap in turn thanks to the NRA and those like you
      
      This is getting bad as your ” Metaphor ”
      
      LOL !
      
      2 7
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      December 27, 2016 12:49pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Nice of you to finally admit you’re a liar. But we all knew that already.
        Heh ,heh , heh!
        
        8 1
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        December 27, 2016 12:52pm
      - pentwig
        
        fuckwit daffy
        
        3 1
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        December 27, 2016 8:02pm
- Colville
  
  A first term Obama would have taken The Don easily on the back on Him being the first Black President but even by the second term the gloss had gone off him and it was obvious that the colour of his skin added nothing to the job.
  Obama wanting a third term would have been slaughtered by Trump. Too many failures and lies, just too much sitting on his hand (or playing golf and letting the world go to hell.
  
  IMHO. Hahaha 😉
  
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  December 27, 2016 9:35am
  - Disaster Area
    
    It will be interesting to see how the mid terms go under Trump. Don’t forget that Obama had to deal with Republican controlled Senate and Congress.
    
    If Hillary won the popular vote and people really are as concerned with Trump as the media make out, there could be a swing for Democrats to control the Houses to stymie Trump in the same way.
    
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    December 27, 2016 9:43am
  - stephieboy
    
    Colville the joys of Nov 6th 2012
    
    IMHO. Hahaha … !
    
    PS was Clint Eastwood Mitt’s Mascot ?
    
    IMHO. Hahaha … !
    
    1 13
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    December 27, 2016 10:19am
    - pentwig
      
      fuckwit
      
      7 5
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      December 27, 2016 11:41am
      - Gabby
        
        merkin
        
        3 8
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        December 27, 2016 12:51pm
- mikenmild
  
  To be fair, I think polls consistently showed almost anyone would have done better against Trump than Clinton.
  
  15 3
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  December 27, 2016 9:35am
  - Harriet
    
    Trump to beat Cruz but Cruz to beat Clinton was a position for quite some time.
    
    6 2
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    December 27, 2016 9:47am
- stephieboy
  
  Inandout and other Trumpazees ,take us back to the day November 2012 when Mitt went belly-up at the last two or so hurdles ?
  
  3 12
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  December 27, 2016 10:09am
  - Dave Mann
    
    I don’t subscribe to your stupid religion and I normally ignore any thread where you have commented….. but my eye was caught by your word ‘Trumpanzees’ and I just HAD to LOL! Nice one ???
    
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    December 27, 2016 1:46pm
Stars And Stripes

LGBT communities mourn George Michael
http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/world/321283/lgbt-communities-mourn-george-Michael.
“A fellow 1980s pop star and Live Aid performer, Paul Young, said Michael had a positive influence on the LGBT community by coming out and becoming an unapologetic figure of gay visibility.
“I think he probably made a bigger contribution to the positive gay movement than people think – we need to look at that again. He was so open about it, made it feel like a natural thing.”

A lot of nice words there but not sure myself whether habitual cruising of public toilets, drug taking and alcohol abuse is really such a positive influence.
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December 27, 2016 9:32am
- Inandout
  
  Reminds me of that episode of ‘Extras’ when Ricky G was sitting on a park bench, but unaware it was a gay meeting point. The raging actor friend of Ricky’s sat beside him and mentioned there was a shortage of ‘cock’, but perhaps ‘George Michael will be along soon’.
  
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  December 27, 2016 9:48am
- Nukuleka
  
  According to the MSM gays are the new Mother Teresa’s of our age, caring, sharing and setting a high moral tone that straights can only aspire to- and rarely achieve. The reality is somewhat different. And before anyone accuses me of homophobia… Well, just don’t!
  
  22 4
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  December 27, 2016 9:57am
  - PhilBest
    
    Milo Yiannopolous is delightfully candid about this. How well known is he to KB-ers?
    
    6 2
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    December 27, 2016 10:10am
    - mikenmild
      
      Oh, he has his fans. Appeals to bigots who like to dress their self-loathing up in pseudo-intellectual fancy dress.
      
      8 15
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      December 27, 2016 10:14am
      - Ed Snack
        
        Very homophobic of you mikenmild, thought you abhorred such stuff, but as always, it’s OK to use against those that are the subject of your group hatred.
        
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        December 28, 2016 10:41am
    - rightoverlabour
      
      Very well known to me. Of cource Generation snowflake HATE him.
      
      13 1
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      December 27, 2016 11:04am
      - stephieboy
        
        Twink Milo Yiannopolous Gay con also into cottaging ?
        
        “Glenn Beck: Breitbart Homocon Milo Yiannopoulos Is The Goebbels Of Donald Trump’s Campaign”
        
        http://www.joemygod.com/2016/03/28/glenn-beck-breitbart-homocon-milo-yiannopoulos-is-the-goebbels-of-donald-trumps-campaign/
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:47am
      - All_on_Red
        
        ‘Twink’?
        What a homophobe.
        
        4 1
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        December 27, 2016 3:13pm
  - Kimbo
    
    @ Nukuleka
    
    And before anyone accuses me of homophobia… Well, just don’t!
    
    Pfft. I’m tempted to ask “And what happens if we do?”. But as you never bother to debate your spray and walk away/Opus Dei talking points, I doubt, as there is no sport involved, anyone can bother.
    
    I do wonder though about the cognitive process by which one can view any critique of their religion or ideology is persecution on a meta-narrative scale, yet they see no problem in laddling out over-generalised bitch-slaps to supposed competing minorities.
    
    Sorry, Nukuleka, I forgot, you requested I make it plain what I am really saying. Just for you: I don’t hold your attitude – whatever it is – to gay people in contempt. I couldn’t care less. Instead, it is your intellectual cowardice to challenge your thoughts and prejudices, while justifying it with a lazy second-hand vestige of cultural Christendom that puts you down my list of favourites, inhabited by other one note Christian conservatives such as…Scott. That, and you squeal like a bitch when you get your own medicine back
    
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    December 27, 2016 11:12am
- Dave Mann
  
  Poor guy. He apparently died of ‘heart failure’, which possibly means an accidentally overdose of something… but more likely he was listening to a collection of his own greatest hits and just gave up in despair at the futility of his life’s work. Not wishing to be too unkind, but his ‘music’ was a load of platitudinous saccharine dross, frankly. Here was a ‘musician’ who could strip a song of almost everything and turn it into tuneless waffle. Why did he sell so much of this rubbish?
  
  EDIT: I have limited my comment to a critique of this person’s musical ability because, of course, being a flagrant homosexual and toilet prowler is a wonderful and inspirational lifestyle choice in today’s world and I wouldn’t want to suggest otherwise.
  
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  December 27, 2016 10:17am
Maggy Wassilieff

The downticker is up bright and early again…

Consider the implications of NOT being down-ticked:
Has the down-ticker missed your posting?
Does the down-ticker agree with your posting?
Is He (couldn’t be a she) deliberately ignoring you?
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December 27, 2016 9:32am
- waikatogirl
  
  Maggy, your comment is certainly not being ignored or overlooked this bright sunny morning, attracting plenty of downticks.
  
  Perhaps in 2017 those negative individuals will find that trying a more positive outlook is more empowering than wallowing in their negative shit.
  
  Tragic New Year all you negative downticking morons!
  
  9 9
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  December 27, 2016 10:00am
- Ed Snack
  
  Maggy, gave you a down-tick just to make sure that you didn’t feel unwanted and unnoticed !
  
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  December 28, 2016 10:44am
holysheet

Have just read a interesting book. In it the comment was made that by the year 2050, a third of Europe’s population will be over 60.
Could this be the only rational reason why the present leadership in Europe have opened the borders to young highly fertile refugees. In this way, by intergrating the useless refugees with the inteligent locals, they will eventually have a workforce with some modicum of sense to keep the economies going.
The flaw in this plan is these refugees will turn the first world economy that is Europe into a third world shithole, before their master plan is achieved.
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December 27, 2016 9:42am
- Harriet
  
  Allowing the numbers in is one thing – changing their attitudes is another matter all together. Any place with a muslim population heading towards 50% will end up muslim……or under military rule. The EU is almost military rule.
  
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  December 27, 2016 9:52am
  - Disaster Area
    
    ‘The EU is almost military rule.’
    
    Citation required.
    
    4 6
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    December 27, 2016 10:22am
  - stephieboy
    
    Harriet , Muslim population 50 % ?
    
    Source please ?
    
    1 12
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    December 27, 2016 10:24am
- Reid
  
  Of course that’s their plan hs. People with IQ are far more difficult to control than people without. And control is their objective and has been for the last four or so hundred years.
  
  They’re not interested in a first-world economy, you see. They’re interested in maintaining a lifestyle akin to 17th century feudal European aristocracy with 21st century comforts.
  
  Check the Georgia Guidestones for the plan. Population: half a billion. They’ll maintain enough technocrats to keep them in the manner they think they deserve, while the rest of us scrabble round in the dirt, like the peasants used to. That’s their plan. I don’t like it much, is why I speak out about what they’re doing, all the time.
  
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  December 27, 2016 9:54am
  - mikenmild
    
    “they”
    Scary.
    
    3 9
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    December 27, 2016 10:00am
  - Disaster Area
    
    ‘Of course that’s their plan is’
    
    Who are ‘they’?
    
    4 3
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    December 27, 2016 10:23am
  - Reid
    
    They’re the people who put up the Georgia Guidestones. For example.
    
    They do lots of other things too.
    
    All you need to do is google.
    
    3 3
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    December 27, 2016 10:33am
    - mikenmild
      
      ‘Georgia Guidestones’. Chuckle.
      Thanks for that, Reid. Another piece of bullshit for the weak minded to read some kind of geopolitical significance into.
      
      6 3
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      December 27, 2016 10:42am
      - Reid
        
        But you know not who put them there, what they say drips with evil, yet you chuckle?
        
        If one is looking for a high level summary of what these people want and represent, that is as succinct as anything else.
        
        Do you know why they put them there? Because there is something in their arrangements which requires them to give us warnings before a big event happens and those guidestones are in that vein. It’s part of a pact they have.
        
        I’m not surprised you miss the point mm, I wasn’t kidding about the sneering, you know, I was serious, there have to be specialists in this area, there has to be a medical name for it. Even if you’re not suffering, the rest of us are. Think about the humans mm. Oh the humanity!
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:01am
      - mikenmild
        
        Oh, so ‘they’ are just like Bond villains who are compelled to spell out their evil plans just before the hero thwarts them?
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:40am
      - Ed Snack
        
        I see (via wiki) that commandment 3 is “Unite humanity with a living new language.”
        
        It’s the Esperanto scourge come back to life, run, flee for your life (or lives if you believe in reincarnation) !
        
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        December 28, 2016 10:50am
- stephieboy
  
  holyexcrement ,spouting forth White Genocide and associated demographics crap yet again ?
  
  2 17
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  December 27, 2016 10:22am
  - pentwig
    
    idiot
    troll
    
    7 6
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    December 27, 2016 11:46am
    - Gabby
      
      merkin
      merkin
      
      5 9
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      December 27, 2016 12:57pm
- UrbanNeocolonialist
  
  Supporting uneducated immigrants and non-integrating communities on welfare is enormously expensive. They are a net drain.
  Meanwhile, a well educated middle class graduate will contribute far more than a million dollars in tax over a lifetime. But overtaxing those middle class tax cows and allowing property in cities to appreciate to such insane levels (while subsidising fertility of poor and migrants) prevents or limits their fertility.
  
  Policy makers deluding themselves that crappy parents in lower-than-average IQ lower classes can fill the demographic hole that excessive cost of living for young middle class creates are wrecking western civilization.
  
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  December 27, 2016 11:41am
Reid

Here’s the Saker’s take on the Russian choir plane crash. After assessing the likelihood of mechanical etc failures and dismissing each, he concludes it’s most likely a bomb, most likely from a Ukraine source.

Note however RT and other Russian media are saying: “Tech failure & human error among main theories for Tu-154 crash, terrorism all but ruled out”

I’ve been wondering on this, whether the govt is taking this line because it’s not as much interested in the Ukrainian perpetrators but rather in the decision-makers in the US and they’re planning on hitting them. Maybe not Obama although it has his girly petulant fingerprints all over it, this is exactly the sort of action he takes, precise same thing as the special forces attack on the Russian hospital, get the innocents, make a point. I was reading yesterday Obama vs Putin is like observing kids in school where one kid always beats the other no matter what it is and the loser keeps challenging him to other things and keeps losing. A very apt analogy I thought.

I’m not saying they’ll hit Obama but they may do something to Ash Carter or similar, and it won’t be pretty. I recall a story from the Beirut days when one of the groups kidnapped some Russian diplomats so the heavies went in and killed the kidnappers families before killing them. No-one touched the Russians again.

I’m not saying anything like that will happen but something will if it isn’t simply a technical failure and if it does happen, the point to remember is that it’s not Russia’s fault it’s Obama’s girlish pettiness that brought it about in the first place.

6. Sabotage/bomb: most likely simply because all other causes are even less likely. True, this was a military aircraft with, supposedly, good security. Alas, I can confirm from personal experience that if you look Russian and speak Russian like a native and if you act the right way, military security in Russia is nowhere near as good as it should be. However, if you speak with an accent or look foreign, and that includes speaking with a Caucasian accent or looking like somebody from the Caucasus, you would have a much harder time beating the controls.

For all these reasons and even though it is way too early to speculate, my of preferred hypothesis is that it was a terrorist act executed by Ukrainian operatives. I hope that I am wrong and that I will be proven wrong in the next 24 hours but at this point in time, this appears to me as the most likely scenario.

http://www.unz.com/tsaker/the-disaster-of-the-russian-military-tu-154/
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December 27, 2016 9:51am
- mikenmild
  
  The dickhead ‘Saker’ can diagnose the cause of aircraft crashes from thousands of kilometres away?
  
  8 4
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  December 27, 2016 9:53am
  - Reid
    
    No he can assess the probability of each possible alternative mm, which he does very well, as you will see when you read it.
    
    Fuck you’re dumb. Either that, or your sneering has become so habitual its penetrated your mind and become such an engrained habit you don’t even notice you’re doing it anymore. Maybe you should see someone about that: “Excuse me Doctor, I seem to have something wrong with my face…”
    
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    December 27, 2016 10:00am
    - stephieboy
      
      Reid , RT takes an entirely different view ( much more closer to the scene )
      
      “Tech failure & human error among main theories for Tu-154 crash, terrorism all but ruled out,”
      
      https://www.rt.com/news/371796-tu154-crash-main-versions/
      
      LOL ! You DUMB ASS !
      
      4 15
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      December 27, 2016 10:29am
      - Reid
        
        Yes I mentioned that in my original post stephie in fact it was one of the central points to the whole thing. I realise my post had a terrific number of of big words in it, but try, try again and eventually you’ll be able to tell us what colour is the cat stuck in the tree in the book you’re reading and maybe in ten or so years you’ll be equipped at least to read posts on KB if not quite yet to fully understand them.
        
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        December 27, 2016 10:44am
      - stephieboy
        
        Reid, but you add this disclaimer ,
        
        “..I’ve been wondering on this, whether the govt is taking this line because it’s not as much interested in the Ukrainian perpetrators but rather in the decision-makers in the US and they’re planning on hitting them. Maybe not Obama although it has his girly petulant fingerprints all over it, this is exactly the sort of action he takes, precise same thing as the special forces attack on the Russian hospital, get the innocents, make a point. I was reading yesterday Obama vs Putin is like observing kids in school where one kid always beats the other no matter what it is and the loser keeps challenging him to other things and keeps losing ”
        
        “Ukrainian perpetrators … etc ”
        
        Retract please !
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:56am
      - Reid
        
        Why?
        
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        December 27, 2016 12:10pm
      - stephieboy
        
        This from you,
        
        “Note however RT and other Russian media are saying: “Tech failure & human error among main theories for Tu-154 crash, terrorism all but ruled out”
        
        Now why could you not leave it at that ?
        
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        December 27, 2016 12:19pm
      - Reid
        
        Because I didn’t want to.
        
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        December 27, 2016 2:35pm
    - RichardX
      
      Reid
      No he can assess the probability of each possible alternative mm, which he does very well, as you will see when you read it.
      …..
      DECEMBER 27, 2016 10:00AM
      
      I did read it as I find it amusing when you rely on dodgy sources and no evidence
      
      Maybe he could assess the probability of some of the alternatives but he does not do it well, let alone very well.
      
      Mechanical failure: unlikely…..It’s safety record is comparable to most aircraft of its time
      
      Nope
      
      http://www.fearofflying.com/resources/safest-airliners-and-airline-safety.shtml
      
      http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/22/world/europe/22russia.html
      
      Pilot error: highly unlikely.
      
      The article rates the most prevalent cause of aviation accidents as highly unlikely but bases it on questionable assumptions. I’ll leave Reid to google which of the assumptions are the dodgy ones
      
      Fuel issues and bird strike are both ruled out in part due to the lack of communication.
      Should an emergency situation arise, pilots are taught to aviate, navigate, communicate in that order. Communicating with someone else during an emergency is not a priority
      A lack of communication is evidence for nothing other than a lack of communication
      
      You need to find more reliable sources on aviation matters
      You hypocritically accept a source without evidence because you trust it and it confirms what you already believe
      
      It is a bit like you believing the internet propaganda that complex flight manoeuvres were required for the hijacked aircraft to hit the World Trade Centers
      
      It is a bit like your belief that Mossad were responsible for the door of the charter plane in which Helen Clark was flying, opening in mid flight.
      
      It is a bit like your belief that I am someone called TIm with no evidence to support you proposition
      
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      December 27, 2016 1:25pm
      - Reid
        
        Richard perhaps you should look at the site before you start talking about things you clearly don’t understand because you haven’t read any of it and if so cite the articles you have.
        
        As far as the rest of your ramble goes, you see, it only happened a few days ago and there’s no wreckage yet recovered. So there is as yet no evidence either way, which is why as I explained to mm and it appears the class has another slow one, it’s an assessment of probabilities.
        
        Your citing BTW the same Western MSM who a) told us WMDs were in Iraq and b) told us Killary would win and was great in support of your “case” is amusing, if somewhat pathetic, in a grasping at straws kind of way.
        
        Don’t you understand either, the Russian military is not a civilian airline? All the difference. And the Russian military is quite good, isn’t it. Look how well its doing in Syria, for example.
        
        And in terms of what Mossad does, what’s your view of the possible options it’s got to retaliate against us for what we’ve just done. It’s going to be murder, isn’t it. But what could it be. Take that to the main thread if you’re going to reply.
        
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        December 27, 2016 2:43pm
      - RichardX
        
        I did look at the site and I responded to your assertion that “he can assess the probability of each possible alternative mm, which he does very well”
        
        He does not assess the probability of each possible alternative at all well
        You may want to make it a different discussion, but I was refuting your specific statement
        
        “Your [sic] citing BTW the same Western MSM who a) told us WMDs were in Iraq and b) told us Killary would win and was great in support of your “case” is amusing, if somewhat pathetic, in a grasping at straws kind of way.”
        
        All sources, MSM or not, require evidence to support assertions
        Anyone who accepts anything on the internet without independent verification would have to be some sort of idiot or to use a term you may understand, sheeple.
        You appear happy to hypocritically accept some assertions with fact checking
        You can verify the safety record of the TU154 without using the sources I provided, which is what you should do if you really want to know why the statement It’s safety record is comparable to most aircraft of its time is factually incorrect
        You can also verify the incidence of pilot error in aviation accidents, military or civilian, while you are at it
        
        I have no view on any possible Mossad retaliation to a vote in the UN but I do have a view on “logicians” who rely on logical fallacies
        
        Specifically I am referring to your claim that Mossad was responsible for the door of the charter plane in which Helen Clark was flying, opening in mid flight
        
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        December 27, 2016 3:25pm
      - Reid
        
        Richard you’ve said nothing to the points I countered with. Until you do that there’s no point responding further.
        
        1 5
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        December 27, 2016 5:12pm
      - RichardX
        
        Reid
        I did respond to the points that were relevant to the original post
        I read the original article
        It was factually incorrect
        You claimed that the author assessed the probability of each possibility “very well”
        That too was incorrect
        You have a track record of similar factually incorrect statements particularly on those conspiracy theories that involve aviation
        
        As previously stated, you may want to make it a different discussion, but I was refuting your specific statement
        
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        December 27, 2016 8:00pm
      - Ed Snack
        
        RichardX, the U-154’s safety record isn’t all that bad given that it was often flown from very poor facilities. It was designed (and was capable of) flying from Gravel air-strips and often flew in the Russian (Soviet as it dates from the 1960’s) Arctic territories.
        
        I see that it has had something like 56 known fatal crashes, but it has flown a lot of miles often in demanding circumstances and no doubt with less than stellar maintenance.
        
        All the same, the Tu-154 is pretty old now, and although it can with upgrades have a fairly long life I would think that any still around would be old and somewhat more prone to failure.
        
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        December 28, 2016 10:58am
- Reid
  
  Those of who don’t have the background and even perhaps doubt the US involvement in Ukraine, might find this useful, which outlines the CIA operations in Ukraine since 1957.
  
  http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2016/01/08/cia-undermining-and-nazifying-ukraine-since-1953.html
  
  3 10
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  December 27, 2016 10:19am
  - stephieboy
    
    Reid , now why should we evee take your seeriously ever again afer your gigantic srew up over the TU 154 Crash ?
    
    ( BTW which is of 1960s vintage )
    
    5 16
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    December 27, 2016 10:33am
    - pentwig
      
      idiot
      
      10 5
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      December 27, 2016 11:49am
      - Reid
        
        It’s just another discombobulated wurzenflugel pw.
        
        I’ve told DARPA and they’re working on it now.
        
        They contacted me offline after I blew their cover and asked me to let them know if anything else happens. I think I’ve used up about half of my 200 GB limit already with all the emails.
        
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        December 27, 2016 12:13pm
      - Gabby
        
        merkin
        
        1 4
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        December 27, 2016 4:52pm
- Gabby
  
  It was the Devil who made the maintenance staff drink themselves stupid.
  
  3 7
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  December 27, 2016 1:00pm
  - Awww C-mon
    
    use that excuse often Gabster?
    
    Merry Christmas BTW
    
    1 3
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    December 27, 2016 4:38pm
    - Gabby
      
      Reid knows it’s true, squawwwkster.
      His Russian imps are little terrors for draining off the antifreeze for light refreshment.
      
      3 4
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      December 27, 2016 4:51pm
Huevon

Traditional Christmas gathering of the clan Huevon is over for abother year. In the evitable political turn of the conversation certain themes emerged – Bill is a good man but is that enough? Little sympathy for the housing situation. Concern – in hushed tones – about Muslims. They are not wanted here. Take heed National.
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December 27, 2016 10:00am
- Inandout
  
  I noticed a hardening of opinions toward Muslims at our gathering, even from a long time Labour supporter. I almost fell over when said Lab fan exclaimed that ‘there was never this much trouble with immigrants until they brought in those bloody Muslims’. As you say, take heed National.
  
  28 2
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  December 27, 2016 10:14am
  - stephieboy
    
    Inandout , what trouble with our Muslim immigrants ???
    
    2 29
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    December 27, 2016 10:34am
    - Harriet
      
      Well…..if aussie is anything to go by……the police never militarised themselves or their operations when the Greeks arrived…..or the Italians…..or the Vietnamese…or the Chinese…..just the muslims. 😎
      
      21 3
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      December 27, 2016 10:48am
      - stephieboy
        
        Harriet , so every Muslim living and walking the streets of Australia is responsible for the “militarisation ” of police ?
        
        http://www.voicesagainstbigotry.org/imamspositions-on-australian-muslims/
        
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        December 27, 2016 10:51am
      - PhilBest
        
        It’s a tricky one, because there are “peaceful Muslims”, trouble is even their own kids can end up radicalised and terrorists.
        
        Trouble is, it is too possible for the radicals to prove from holy writ, that the peaceable ones are actually “apostates”, and any reformation back to the real thing has to involve militant Jihad. In contrast, most other faiths have holy writ where all progress is towards peace, turning the other cheek etc.
        
        8 1
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        December 27, 2016 12:03pm
    - pentwig
      
      so,so thick
      dummy
      
      10 8
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      December 27, 2016 11:50am
      - Gabby
        
        so so bald
        merkin
        
        4 11
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        December 27, 2016 1:02pm
    - Inandout
      
      For you, short attention span steph:
      
      PM Erdogan: The Term ‘Moderate Islam’ Is Ugly And Offensive; There Is No Moderate Islam; Islam Is Islam,”
      
      13 0
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      December 27, 2016 11:55am
Reid

Obama Quietly Signs The “Countering Disinformation And Propaganda Act” Into Law

…And so, with the likes of WaPo having already primed the general public to equate “Russian Propaganda” with “fake news” (despite admitting after the fact their own report was essentially “fake”), while the US media has indoctrinated the public to assume that any information which is not in compliance with the official government narrative, or dares to criticize the establishment, is also “fake news” and thus falls under the “Russian propaganda” umbrella, the scene is now set for the US government to legally crack down on every media outlet that the government deems to be “foreign propaganda.”

Just like that, the US Ministry of Truth is officially born.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-24/obama-signs-countering-disinformation-and-propaganda-act-law

Meanwhile, the sheeple munch the green green grass of [fake] bliss, now and then looking up to happily bleat and baa, as life is good and nothing at all could possibli go wrong.
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December 27, 2016 10:31am
Inandout

Obama said in a recent interview that he finds Christmas snowmen ‘rather creepy’, yet ironically most of his supporters are snowflakes; go figure.
17 3
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December 27, 2016 10:35am
- stephieboy
  
  Inandout,
  
  http://funnyand.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/Weak-Strong-People.jpg
  
  2 19
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  December 27, 2016 10:39am
Manolo

The bugger will do something useful before disappearing:
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/u-n-secretary-general-ban-ki-moon-release-times-square-n700246
8 2
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December 27, 2016 11:16am
- Reid
  
  He’s running for President of South Korea Manolo and he’s leading in the polls.
  
  9 3
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  December 27, 2016 11:29am
  - Maggy Wassilieff
    
    https://sputniknews.com/asia/201612261048992000-ban-ki-moon-president-south-korea/
    
    But those South Koreans better check out allegations of bribe-taking closely
    https://sputniknews.com/asia/201612251048988740-ban-denies-taking-bribes/
    
    6 1
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    December 27, 2016 11:50am
    - Reid
      
      Yes. I didn’t say it was a good thing Maggy.
      
      4 3
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      December 27, 2016 12:17pm
Manolo

Vain, arrogant, and deluded to the point of madness:
http://edition.cnn.com/2016/12/26/politics/axe-files-president-obama/index.html

Arguing that Americans still subscribe to his vision of progressive change, President Barack Obama asserted in an interview recently he could have succeeded in this year’s election if he was eligible to run.
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December 27, 2016 11:19am
Reid

Gingrich: Obama in ‘desperate frenzy’ to leave legacy

He sure is, but most of his legacy is in the form of EO’s which he’s been using heavily since he lost Congress and those can be repealed by the POTUS. His Affordable Care Act is going to be taken apart and then his legacy remains one of death and destruction.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/12/25/gingrich-obama-in-desperate-frenzy-to-leave-legacy.html?refresh=true
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December 27, 2016 11:28am
- Inandout
  
  Obama can now as a lame duck gesture commute prison sentences for murderers and rapists, but not Muslim terrorists from Gitmo thank goodness.
  
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  December 27, 2016 12:06pm
- PhilBest
  
  I am quietly optimistic that Trump will not wind back the US healthcare system to the status quo prior to Obamacare, but will achieve an improvement from multiple angles. Obamacare was a typical lefty project – lofty intentions are all that mattered, not real-life costs, incomes, price signals, incentives, etc. Sacred constituencies such as tort lawyers, are not to be harmed.
  
  There were known proposals of ways to address the problems that did exist, but Obamacare did not incorporate any of them.
  
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  December 27, 2016 12:08pm
- stephieboy
  
  Reid , and Trump and Putin will finally lead us all to the Promised land ?
  
  Yeah right !
  
  https://i.redditmedia.com/q1OHuuNehMFamEekVxKlWObiaoRPj_CNExuDtmrBNIs.jpg?w=620&s=79988840de9a994b7bc61ec9a992ec84
  
  Obama 4.9% unemployment , 1.7 % inflation , record exports etc, etc
  
  2 16
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  December 27, 2016 12:10pm
  - Reid
    
    stephie 94% of the new jobs created under Obama are parti-time. Once you factor in the people who have given up looking for work the unemployment looks more like 20-25%.
    
    Not to mention Obama’s death and destruction overseas, which is the only legacy he’ll have.
    
    So Trump won’t need to do anything at all to beat that, will he. He will actually do a great deal stephie, but he doesn’t need to, to beat the evil Obongo, does he.
    
    8 3
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    December 27, 2016 12:22pm
    - stephieboy
      
      Reid , 94 % part time ? Source please ?
      
      My source unemployment figure is here ,
      
      https://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000
      
      How will Trump create the full time jobs to achieve 0 % unemployment ?
      
      Death and Destruction ?
      
      Here ?
      
      http://www.thewhy.com/wp-content/uploads/008-Aleppo.jpg
      
      2 7
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      December 27, 2016 12:34pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        http://www.forbes.com/sites/peterferrara/2012/02/09/dont-be-fooled-the-obama-unemployment-rate-is-11/#2341ba983d23
        http://www.gallup.com/opinion/chairman/181469/big-lie-unemployment.aspx
        http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/feb/10/donald-lambro-obama-hides-jobs-failure-by-not-coun/
        http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2011/12/os_legacy_unemployment_rate_now_meaningless.html
        
        Your graph excludes the Metric U6 and is only U3…
        U6 includes;
        ‘U-6 Total unemployed, plus all persons marginally attached to the labor force, plus total employed part time for economic reasons, as a percent of the civilian labor force plus all persons marginally attached to the labor force’
        Which is a more accurate measure.
        Looking at it here the unemployment rate is actually 9.3%
        https://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t15.htm
        
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        December 27, 2016 12:44pm
      - stephieboy
        
        All on Red , why is Trump’s up wards 42 % unemployment so right and Secretary of Labour Thomas Perez so wrong ,5 % ?,
        
        “There’s a reason his name rhymes with dump”: Labor secretary slaughters Donald Trump’s bogus unemployment statistics
        
        Thomas Perez was entirely candid about Donald Trump and the GOP’s “fact-free zone” when it comes to employment
        
        “Real Time” host Bill Maher Friday night sat down with Secretary of Labor Thomas Perez.
        
        Maher began by citing GOP frontrunner Donald Trump’s hearsay statistic that the unemployment rate is upwards of 42% — an infuriatingly ridiculous figure that could only be believed by a Trump supporter — as opposed to the Bureau of Labor Statistics’ estimated 5%.
        
        “There’s a reason his name rhymes with dump,” Perez explained. “Because he’s really full of you-know-what.”
        
        “The reality is … this president inherited a mess,” he continued. “The unemployment rate was inching up to 10%, 2 million-plus jobs lost in the three months before he took office, and now we’ve seen 73 months in a row of private sector job growth to the tune of over 14 million jobs.”
        
        “The fact-free zone is indeed fact-free,” he added.
        
        http://www.salon.com/2016/04/09/theres_a_reason_his_name_rhymes_with_dump_labor_secretary_slaughters_donald_trumps_bogus_unemployment_statistics/
        
        “Facts are Stubborn statistics are pliable ”
        
        Mark Twain
        
        Can’t wait to try and squirm and wriggle you way out of that one ?
        
        Trump’s hearsay figure true and correct ?
        
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        December 27, 2016 12:58pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Obama changed the official definition of unemployment in 2012.
        Real Unemployment is still close to 10% (source BLS)
        Mind you, the change has continued to trick gullible fools like you- lol!
        And, it’s been explained to you on numerous occasions but thicky that you are, you still don’t get it.hahahahaha
        
        Edit, Stephie- changing the subject when you’ve been caught out doesn’t change the fact, you’ve been caught out…
        
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        December 27, 2016 1:04pm
      - stephieboy
        
        All on Red , is Trump’s heresay figure of upwards 42 % True and correct or is Thomas Perez ( 5 % ) lying ?
        
        Sucker !
        
        Go and stuff your stats and Trump’s up your date !
        
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        December 27, 2016 1:11pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Not interested in deciphering your gibberish Stephie and don’t care.
        Doesn’t matter. You were wrong(again)
        Trump won. You are the sucker.
        
        Edit, I see your edit, hahahahaha, getting shitty eh. Go for it
        #strike 3! Byeeee
        How did you get that strike 2 again?
        
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        December 27, 2016 1:15pm
      - stephieboy
        
        All On Red , so Trump’s heresay figure 42% is correct ?
        
        Yet another of your dumb metaphors ?
        
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        December 27, 2016 1:21pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        No idea what Trump said. I’m not defending him. Just pointing out where you are wrong. (So easy btw- your own links do it, lol!!!!)
        As I said, changing the subject doesn’t change the fact you were wrong. Again, eh Dummy.
        
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        December 27, 2016 1:30pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Got any answer to any of this?- thought not. Just change the subject. Hahahaha
        9.3%
        
        http://www.forbes.com/sites/peterferrara/2012/02/09/dont-be-fooled-the-obama-unemployment-rate-is-11/#2341ba983d23
        http://www.gallup.com/opinion/chairman/181469/big-lie-unemployment.aspx
        http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/feb/10/donald-lambro-obama-hides-jobs-failure-by-not-coun/
        http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2011/12/os_legacy_unemployment_rate_now_meaningless.html
        
        Your graph excludes the Metric U6 and is only U3…
        U6 includes;
        ‘U-6 Total unemployed, plus all persons marginally attached to the labor force, plus total employed part time for economic reasons, as a percent of the civilian labor force plus all persons marginally attached to the labor force’
        Which is a more accurate measure.
        Looking at it here the unemployment rate is actually 9.3%
        https://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t15.htm
        
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        December 27, 2016 1:37pm
      - stephieboy
        
        All on Red ,
        
        Trump’s varying guesstimates on the “unemployment hoax ”
        
        “..Don’t believe those phony numbers,” Trump declared during his victory speech after the New Hampshire primary, in February. “When you hear 4.9 and five-per-cent unemployment, the number’s probably twenty-eight, twenty-nine, as high as thirty-five—in fact, I even heard recently forty-two per cent.” By June, when he did an interview on Fox News’s “Justice with Judge Jeanine,” he’d received new data. “The number five per cent is a phony number—it’s really twenty per cent, close to twenty-per-cent unemployment. That’s just a phony number to make the politicians look good.” In an August speech on the economy, he said, in reference to the official government unemployment rate, “The five-per-cent figure is one of the biggest hoaxes in American modern politics.”
        
        That, within a six-month span, Trump’s estimates ranged from twenty, or “close to twenty,” per cent all the way up to forty-two per cent suggest he’s not using an overly rigorous model. His are statistics verified by gut feeling and bold, bald assertion. The unemployment rate is not a hoax—it is subject to a range of checks and balances. There are tens of thousands of people who are involved in constructing and reviewing it each month, and seven decades of data from which to compare each new figure with the ones that came before it…”
        
        http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/trump-and-the-truth-the-unemployment-rate-hoax
        
        Now which one of his is correct ?
        
        Now take your time .Also thinking about your CJD.
        
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        December 27, 2016 1:45pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Stephie
        I realise you are pretty thick, but I’m not Donald Trump…If you don’t know what he means send him a tweet and see if he answers.
        I think from my link above sourcing BLS stats that a more accurate measure is 9.3% not the 4.9% you constantly claim.
        Still, no doubt (to our great amusement) you will continue to quote it, so that’s funny.
        I got to ask you Stephie. Why do you come on here? You get made to look stupid every day. Are you a glutton for punishment, a gullible fool, no other life? All?
        Sad really.
        
        Edit- I see you usual extra edit. CJD,Mad Cow Disease huh. Lol, a Cowpat is smarter than you- and more useful!
        
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        December 27, 2016 1:54pm
      - stephieboy
        
        All On Red , I rest contended and assured with the figures gathered by Thomas Perez and his Department of Labour rather than Trump’s Hoax figures and those ideolgically and politically allied to him .
        
        The final and official figure that can’t be lied about ,
        
        https://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000
        
        No different to ours,
        
        http://www.tradingeconomics.com/new-zealand/unemployment-rate
        
        Or do you suggest our rate is another hoax ?
        
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        December 27, 2016 2:36pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Got any answer to any of this?- thought not. Just change the subject. Hahahaha
        9.3%
        
        http://www.forbes.com/sites/peterferrara/2012/02/09/dont-be-fooled-the-obama-unemployment-rate-is-11/#2341ba983d23
        http://www.gallup.com/opinion/chairman/181469/big-lie-unemployment.aspx
        http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/feb/10/donald-lambro-obama-hides-jobs-failure-by-not-coun/
        http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2011/12/os_legacy_unemployment_rate_now_meaningless.html
        
        Your graph excludes the Metric U6 and is only U3…
        U6 includes;
        ‘U-6 Total unemployed, plus all persons marginally attached to the labor force, plus total employed part time for economic reasons, as a percent of the civilian labor force plus all persons marginally attached to the labor force’
        Which is a more accurate measure.
        Looking at it here the unemployment rate is actually 9.3% not 4.6%
        https://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t15.htm
        
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        December 27, 2016 3:06pm
      - PhilBest
        
        The other point that should be made, is that most of the jobs growth that has occurred “under Obama”, especially the export-led jobs growth, has been in business-friendly, low-cost States. Especially the ones where gas fracking has not been obstructed, and the ones where developers can still whack up new subdivisions on farmland with no price-gouging. Take a look at “Texanomics” blog – Texas alone can take most of the credit for any growth that has happened “under Obama”, and this is in spite of O and his administration and what they would impose on States like Texas if they could.
        
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        December 27, 2016 5:24pm
      - stephieboy
        
        All on Red , utter bollux . Consider the process by which Trump arrived at his 42.% .He used the figure work of David Stockman who served as Director of the Office of Management and Budget under President Reagan ( .He is among many things a prophet of of doom . conspiracy theorist and Gold Bugist – believes the US should go back to the Gold standard )
        
        Here how he arrived at 42 %,
        ,
        
        “..At the present time, there are 210 million adult Americans between the ages of 16 and 68—to take a plausible measure of the potential work force. That amounts to 420 billion potential labor hours, if we accept the convention that all adults are at least theoretically capable of holding a full-time job (2,000 hours/year) and pulling their share of society’s need for production and work effort.
        
        By contrast, during 2014 only 240 billion hours were actually supplied to the US economy, according to the BLS estimates. Technically, therefore, there were 180 billion unemployed labor hours, meaning that the real unemployment rate was 42.9%, not 5.5%! “
        
        Also under GWB according to the Bureau of Labour and statistics the unemployment rate was 2007 5.0% Using the same analysis as your sources we’d have to say it was at least 10 % . Or Stockman’s ,say 41 %
        
        So which is it in 2016 , 4.9 % , your 9.3 or Trump’s 42% ?
        
        http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2015/08/20/donald_trump_says_the_real_unemployment_rate_is_42_it_s_not.html
        
        also,
        
        “TRUMP AND THE TRUTH: THE UNEMPLOYMENT-RATE HOAX”
        
        http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/trump-and-the-truth-the-unemployment-rate-hoax
        
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        December 27, 2016 8:43pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Sigh, you truly are a complete idiot. It’s 9.3%
        Look at this link I quote
        https://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.t15.htm
        The letters BLS stand for Bureau of Labor Statistics. These are official statistics.
        How about having a look at it instead of waffling off on vague crap about Trump.
        You will see that the 4.6% is shown as is the 9.3%.
        It’s been explained to you countless times why the higher figure is a more accurate representation of unemployment in the US. The newspaper links above confirm that Obama changed which figure he was going to use.
        I don’t think I’ve ever come across anyone so dumb as you. To ignore such clear evidence is ignorant stubbornness.
        
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        December 27, 2016 8:50pm
  - Steve (North Shore)
    
    Trump and Putin will work together and turn the Middle East into glass. No source – just my opinion.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9t_KDGqOmE
    
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    December 27, 2016 5:27pm
  - pentwig
    
    fuckwit daffy
    dunces corner
    now!!
    
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    December 27, 2016 8:23pm
Captain Mainwaring

Sounds like Greg O’Connor might stand for Labour in Ohariu and if he did it would probably be the end of the bouffanted whore.
But is Greg left enough to be acceptable to the current Labour leadership?
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December 27, 2016 11:58am
- Inandout
  
  Perhaps he forgot that members of his Police were shafted by a Labour PM when she ordered the driver to exceed the speed limit, and then left him with the blame.
  
  And I don’t think O’Connor was universally liked by members of the Police.
  
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  December 27, 2016 12:12pm
  - Gabby
    
    He might’ve noticed she’s not the PM any more.
    
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    December 27, 2016 1:24pm
    - Inandout
      
      He however wants to join the same club as her, with the same philosophies.
      
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      December 27, 2016 1:41pm
    - PhilBest
      
      But she has casted a long shadow over everything that happens in NZ, witness the John Key government changing almost nothing, and even enacting parts of Helen’s program that she hadn’t got round to yet.
      
      Edit: and you can bet institutions like the Police remain just as stacked with stooges as they became under Helen, National is clueless about winding back any of this sort of stuff. One of Helen’s first “scandals that should have been”, was rolling Peter Doone on a trumped-up pretext.
      
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      December 27, 2016 5:26pm
- fernglas
  
  Despite being a long term union boss, O’Connor’s political head is well to the right of centre, and I’m surprised that he’s standing for Labour anywhere.
  
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  December 27, 2016 2:06pm
cha

So, when you’re wandering around on a planet in a far away galaxy and you encounter a slimy pod thing that suddenly opens its petals to reveal another slimy mound of quivering goop, the thing to do is to get your face real close for a better look and ….

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0VW6sg50Pk&feature=youtu.be
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December 27, 2016 12:15pm
Reid

A number of writers and critics have noted the astounding smugness and outsized indignation of white liberals during this election season. The Clinton supporters, basically. And I think it is useful to examine the relationship between the media and the Clintons. For no political mafia has ever penetrated Hollywood and NY media to the extent the Clintons have. Shows such as Madame Secretary and House of Cards could well have been scripted by the Clinton inner circle. Hell, by Bill himself. And outlets like Huffington Post and MSNBC and CNN operate as the press outlets for the DNC.

But the real nadir of media capitulation and bad faith was the response to the brutal murder of the Russian diplomat Andrei Karlov in Istanbul, on video, at an art opening. The western press spun this as a freedom fighter attacking the brutal Russian empire and defending Allepo. Almost nothing was said about the family of the slain Russian, or about terrorism. I guess terrorism doesn’t exist if its directed at the enemy du jour. The celebrations on the streets of Aleppo seemed to have been erased by western TV and print editors, too. And all of this is in line, of course, with Hillary Clinton’s (and her advisors) pathological and obsessive hatred of Putin. And with the Clinton imprint on mainstream media.

So, back to those white liberals. Every single person (save one) that I once knew in theatre and in Hollywood, are liberal and none of them really do much in the way of research or political reading. All of them are arch Democrats. And never before, I don’t think ever, has an election so starkly revealed the stratification of classes and sub classes, even, in the U.S. I have found a just amazing, almost surreal level of wilful and intentional blindness on the part of liberal america to the crimes of the Clintons, and to the basic corruption of the Democratic Party. One can say over and over and over and over and over that Clinton orchestrated a neo nazi fascist coup in Ukraine, a fascist junta in Honduras and an illegal assassination of a foreign leader in Libya. You can say this again and again and I guarantee you will get no response. The stunning silence of white liberal America to the crimes of the Clintons stands as the most profound element in the entire scenario of this election.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/12/23/to-go-the-way-of-the-great-auk-the-clintons-and-the-media/

For those who wonder why I don’t always use quotation blocks in my posts, I don’t when it’s long (because IMO it deserves to be). I find this new layout degrades readability and one reason is the narrowness of the page, so every mm counts, is why.
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December 27, 2016 12:58pm
Jack5

Is Bill English going to push for a prisons policy that in effect will mean shorter or non-prison sentences? Will English campaign on a social-liberal policy at the general election?

Jarrod Gilbert, a sociologist-academic seems to be suggesting this in an article in the Hooerald.

In his article, Gilbert puts English in a box for us with this:

Having removed Judith Collins from the Corrections portfolio, English has very publicly signalled that the harder-edged and populist approach does not curry his favour.

I also found this part of Gilbert’s article interesting:

But often there will be no sentence long enough to placate distressed victims or their loved ones, so as a society we must weigh-up those desires with the interests of the public good.

As if, in the debate of the balance of punishment and reform, only “victims or their loved ones” believe punishment is a key role of prisons. Wrong. The debate of punishment v. reform is related to the centuries-long debate of free will v. determinism. Many of us in NZ don’t agree that a liberal approach minimises crime.

NZ doesn’t have a harsh penal system. In fact some young people have less chance of getting tertiary education outside prison than they would as prisoners.

Gilbert wrote the book, Patched the History of Gangs in New Zealand.

Gilbert is also a trustee of the NZ Public Interest Panel, which has been involved in the causes of Mark Lundy and David Bain, as well as of Teina Pora.

Gilbert’s Hooerald article:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11773121
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December 27, 2016 2:10pm
- Reid
  
  We should get rid of parole and instead add time to their sentence if they do something while inside to achieve the same incentive to behave.
  
  We should eliminate all violence and thuggery inside by 24/7/365 surveillance with every transgression taken to court and sentenced per the above. Cumulative sentencing always, never consecutive. Prison should be distasteful but not brutal.
  
  Have two parts to each sentence: the punishment (2/3) and rehab (last third). Punishment is harsh, spartan and rigorous. e.g. Get up at 4 AM, do P.T., carry cannonballs from one end of the courtyard to the other and back again, you get the picture. It’s not brutal, but it’s harsh enough to make the toughest crim never want to repeat the experience.
  
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  December 27, 2016 3:02pm
- PhilBest
  
  If English is moving to softer-touch justice policy, he hands another policy platform to Winston to clean up disaffected past Nat voters. You can bet Winston will be watching this. His main constituency, elderly people, also have strong preferences in the direction that young thugs are not on the loose to invade their homes and break half the brittle bones in their body just for kicks.
  
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  December 27, 2016 5:33pm
  - mikenmild
    
    English’s concern appear to be the enormous cost of satisfying the general demand to lock them up for longer. To be fair, he did refer to prisons as a moral failure as well as a fiscal failure though.
    
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    December 27, 2016 5:42pm
Jack5

Did Obama orchestrate the UN Security Council resolution, co-sponsored by NZ, that was critical of Israel?

The Israelis claim to have evidence of this, reports the Guardian.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/dec/26/israel-un-resolution-settlements-obama-trump
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December 27, 2016 3:03pm
- Manolo
  
  The Muslim dweller of the White House until January 19th is capable of any dirty moves against Israel.
  
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  December 27, 2016 3:20pm
- Gabby
  
  They’re so mad they’re going to refuse the yankers’ dirty aid money.
  
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  December 27, 2016 4:44pm
Manolo

He is classless, hence not a surprise:
http://dailycaller.com/2016/12/26/obama-might-just-weigh-in-on-issues-during-trump-presidency/
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December 27, 2016 3:25pm
EAD

Thanks Jews:

http://newobserveronline.com/french-mayor-trial-truth/

The French mayor of the town of Béziers has been charged with “hate crimes” after saying that it was a “problem” that a class in a local school was 91 percent Muslim.

The charges were brought by the Jewish “International League against Racism and Anti-Semitism” (Ligue Internationale Contre le Racisme et l’Antisémitisme, LICRA).

Mayor Robert Menard denied his comments were discriminatory, saying he had “just described the situation in my town.”
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December 27, 2016 3:44pm
- EAD
  
  All part of a long history from the French Revolution to now of French Jews opposing the French nation:
  
  http://www.breitbart.com/london/2015/12/08/french-jews-urged-vote-front-national-despite-rise-anti-semitic-islamism/
  
  Despite this, the Representative Council of Jewish Institutions in France remains determined to keep the party out by forming a bloc to vote against their candidates. Calling on Jews to mobilise at the voting booth, the council called the FN a “populist and xenophobic party”.
  
  Churchill on the French Revolution and Jews part in it:
  
  Most, if not all of them, have forsaken the faith of their forefathers, and divorced from their minds all spiritual hopes of the next world. This movement among the Jews is not new. From the days of Spartacus-Weishaupt to those of Karl Marx, and down to Trotsky (Russia), Bela Kun (Hungary), Rosa Luxembourg (Germany), and Emma Goldman (United States), this world-wide conspiracy for the overthrow of civilisation and for the reconstitution of society on the basis of arrested development, of envious malevolence, and impossible equality, has been steadily growing. It played, as a modern writer, Mrs. Webster, has so ably shown, a definitely recognisable part in the tragedy of the French Revolution. It has been the mainspring of every subversive movement during the Nineteenth Century; and now at last this band of extraordinary personalities from the underworld of the great cities of Europe and America have gripped the Russian people by the hair of their heads and have become practically the undisputed masters of that enormous empire.
  
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  December 27, 2016 3:54pm
  - Kimbo
    
    Don’t forget the Jewish traitor, Colonel Alfred Dreyfus! J’accuse…! 😉
    
    Then again, I’m probably over-looking the information at your disposal that the Dreyfus Affair was a false flag, too. OK, EAD, let’s have it 🙂
    
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    December 27, 2016 3:58pm
  - mikenmild
    
    Churchill was describing the Bolsheviks, rather than the Jews, but EAD already knew that…
    
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    December 27, 2016 5:19pm
  - stephieboy
    
    EAD, so much for your twisted version of Churchill and of course your National Socialism ,
    
    The German invasion of the Soviet Union in June 1941 was the start of the Holocaust as we know it. Messages reaching Churchill through his intelligence services told of the murder, in groups, of thousands of Jews. He made powerful reference to these killings when he broadcast on November 14 1941:
    
    “‘None has suffered more cruelly than the Jew the unspeakable evils wrought upon the bodies and spirits of men by Hitler and his vile regime. The Jew bore the brunt of the Nazi’s first onslaught upon the citadels of freedom and human dignity. He has borne and continued to bear a burden that might have seen beyond endurance. He has not allowed it to break his spirit; he has never lost the will to resist. Assuredly in the day of victory the Jew’s suffering and his part in the struggle will not be forgotten.’
    
    The deportations from France to Auschwitz began in the summer of 1942. Their destination was unknown at the time, but the fact that the deportations were taking place was reported from Paris, The Times reporting in September that 4000 Jewish children had been deported. On the next day Churchill, speaking about the Nazi regime in the House of Commons, castigated:
    
    ‘… the most bestial, the most squalid and the most senseless of all their offences, namely, the mass deportation of Jews from France, with the pitiful horrors attendant upon the calculated and final scattering of families. This tragedy fills me with astonishment as well as with indignation, and it illustrates as nothing else can the utter degradation of the Nazi nature and theme, and degradation of all who lend themselves to its unnatural and perverted passions.’
    
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/worldwars/genocide/churchill_holocaust_01.shtml
    
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    December 27, 2016 5:45pm
    - Reid
      
      stephie you’d think since the Holocaust was such a big deal wouldn’t you, that the biography’s of the war leaders would have chapters and chapters on it.
      
      Instead, Churchill’s multi-volume The Second World War hardly mentions it, nor does Eisenhower’s and nor does Roosevelts.
      
      Almost as if a propaganda meme was launched soon after the war ended that has turned fact from fact into fact into “accepted” fact, isn’t it.
      
      How mysterious.
      
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      December 27, 2016 6:47pm
      - mikenmild
        
        That’s an interesting level of detail from someone who claims to have never studied the Holocaust. Shall I suggest a simple reading list for you?
        
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        December 27, 2016 6:54pm
      - Reid
        
        Yes again mm, evidently what you consider well read, I consider shallow. That should have been quite obvious from our conversations, I would have thought…
        
        Ahhhh. I was forgetting… Sorry.
        
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        December 27, 2016 6:59pm
      - mikenmild
        
        Just let me know what you consider to be your reading level,and I’ll suggest some age-appropriate books to get you up to speed.
        
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        December 27, 2016 7:02pm
      - stephieboy
        
        Reid , Churchill’s voluminous history of WW2 is essentially a military history with focus on the great miltary engagments whether, the Battle of Britain North Africa , The battle of the Atlantic , Stalingrad , the Siege of Leningrad , Kursk- Orel etc, etc .
        
        The same with Eisenhower . But sure as eggs he was witness to the appalling death and destruction at Buchenwald etc as here ,
        
        http://media.gettyimages.com/photos/12th-april-1945-in-the-centre-with-hands-on-his-hips-general-dwight-d-picture-id3438055
        
        FDR died before the war ended !
        
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        December 27, 2016 8:51pm
    - pentwig
      
      daffy getting angry
      “stephieboy
      
      All on Red , is Trump’s heresay figure of upwards 42 % True and correct or is Thomas Perez ( 5 % ) lying ?
      
      Sucker !
      
      Go and stuff your stats and Trump’s up your date !
      Thumb up 2 Thumb down 13 REPORTDECEMBER 27, 2016 1:11PM
      
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      December 27, 2016 9:07pm
  - PhilBest
    
    That’s interesting, so “Jews” are mostly a problem “because they have forsaken their Jewishness”?
    
    Churchill was certainly onto something. “Jewish” voters in the USA are overwhelmingly culturally and morally liberal. The inheritors of “Judeo-Christian” moral traditions are mostly Christian fundamentalists these days.
    
    But as I keep pointing out, you find Jews everywhere in politics and science and academia and business and so on. For every liberal-lefty columnist there is a conservative counterpart like Daniel Greenfield or Melanie Phillips. To counter the “Jewish” fractional reserve banking advocates, half the writers on Von Mises dot com and Lew Rockwell dot com are Jews.
    
    Jews are massively disproportionately represented among the ranks of the winners of Nobel Prizes of all kinds.
    
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    December 27, 2016 5:46pm
Manolo

New arrivals flood in:
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/12/26/obama-administration-nearly-doubles-number-refugee-arrivals-far-fy-2017/

The Obama administration has accepted 25,584 refugees into the United States in the two months and 26 days since FY 2017 began on October 1, according to the Department of State interactive website.

That number is nearly double the 13,791 refugees accepted during the comparable period between October 1, 2015 and December 26, 2015 of the prior fiscal year (FY 2016).
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December 27, 2016 3:50pm
GoVege

Anyone know Islamalingo for “go home”?
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December 27, 2016 4:28pm
- Awww C-mon
  
  no more money
  
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  December 27, 2016 4:34pm
  - Steve (North Shore)
    
    That is the correct answer – so let’s do it
    
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    December 27, 2016 5:40pm
    - GoVege
      
      But only for the ones who wear those ghastly burqas…y’know, so men can’t gaze upon uncovered meat.
      The rest seem OK.
      
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      December 27, 2016 7:27pm
- holysheet
  
  fuck off?
  
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  December 27, 2016 5:27pm
BeeSting

I am just trying to see how this book fits in Historically with the Holocaust?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germany_Must_Perish!

Not saying bad as it is it was justification because
there is or was none?

Did it start before this book or after?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germany_Must_Perish!

https://archive.org/details/GermanyMustPerish

What I find most fascinating about it, it is used today or at least some or most of its techniques are, and it is almost as if it used as a manual by the EU.

For every European Country not just in Europe
but for Australia and New Zealand to a lesser degree.
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December 27, 2016 4:35pm
- Awww C-mon
  
  Does your shrink now you are posting again?
  
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  December 27, 2016 4:45pm
  - BeeSting
    
    The Protocols of Zion are a Fraud but that is a
    Historical Document. Available free to read and download.
    
    What I find amazing is everyone is happy to Talk
    
    The Holocaust and it gets raised again and again
    and again as it should.
    
    This Propaganda gift to the NATZIs like so much
    BS came out of AMERICA?
    
    Why?
    
    I mean how dare anyone ask simple Questions.
    and learn from the Horrors of History.
    
    “If we cannot end now our differences, at least we can make the world safe for diversity.” JFK
    
    https://www.jfklibrary.org/Asset-Viewer/BWC7I4C9QUmLG9J6I8oy8w.aspx
    
    JFK Sought Peace and got a Bullet for it
    Does Trump get the Same
    
    The Soviet System he refers to did start with
    BS Exported from the USA
    just like…
    
    “Germany Must Perish”
    
    Do you think for one minute JFK
    would line up Nukes on the Russian Border?
    as these Nut jobs
    
    JUST LIKE YOU HAVE
    
    and then collapse Europe?
    
    and start a new arms race
    
    PEACE LIKE JFK gets a BULLET
    and
    
    OBAMA wiped his bum on JFK’s work
    
    Why?
    
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    December 27, 2016 7:08pm
    - Awww C-mon
      
      1/ “Historical Document. Available free to read and download”
      
      it is the ravings of a lunatic (yes every race has them, I’m not being anti-semetic) and your own link states “He was the sole proprietor of the Argyle Press and it is not known to have published any other works” in the first paragraph. A document from history is not a historic document!
      
      2/”This Propaganda gift to the NATZIs like so much
      BS came out of AMERICA?
      
      Why?”
      
      Because a lunatic wrote it, and lunatics continue to read it. It prominence is probably due to its reference by the Nazi’s. Conspiracy?? Not for anyone sane.
      
      3/ “I mean how dare anyone ask simple Questions”
      
      Don’t you mean how dare someone simple ask questions?
      
      4/”JFK Sought Peace and got a Bullet for it
      Does Trump get the Same”
      
      Your first opinion is debatable, your question re trump… it will never be the same, 70 years have passed and they are different people in a different world
      
      Then you get all Shouty McShoutface again and I lose interest.
      
      Now exactly what Meds are you on and when did you take them last??
      
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      December 27, 2016 8:18pm
Manolo

Another weekend in Democratic-run Chicago:
http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2016/12/26/43-shot-11-fatally-in-christmas-weekend-shootings-in-chicago/

Eleven men were killed and at least 37 other people have been wounded in shootings over Christmas weekend across Chicago.

The gun violence since Friday evening has surpassed the toll over the same four-day holiday last year, when 30 people were shot across the city.
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December 27, 2016 4:48pm
- cha
  
  Bottles, too.
  
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  December 27, 2016 5:45pm
- PhilBest
  
  One of the biggest ironies on this, was back when libbewwals were hounding G W Bush for turning Iraq into a “quagmire”, someone pointed out that statistically, Chicago was actually a riskier place to die of criminal violence.
  
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  December 27, 2016 5:49pm
  - stephieboy
    
    Phil Best , Chicago a riskier place than GW Bush’s Iraq war ?
    
    I don’ think so ,
    
    http://web.mit.edu/humancostiraq/
    
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    December 27, 2016 7:46pm
    - pentwig
      
      back to the pond daffy
      
      6 2
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      December 27, 2016 8:33pm
dirty harry

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/87761273/maori-party-dynamic-duo-make-some-noise-in-2016-and-stay-on-the-hunt-for-election-year

Couple of racist pieces of shit.
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December 27, 2016 4:58pm
- mikenmild
  
  I thought you had left us, starboard.
  
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  December 27, 2016 5:13pm
  - Steve (North Shore)
    
    starboard has many identities just like you Mike?
    You did say that today Mike
    
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    December 27, 2016 5:42pm
    - mikenmild
      
      Yes, I did say that. And you can believe it too, if you want.
      But what does dirty harry say?
      
      3 8
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      December 27, 2016 5:51pm
      - Awww C-mon
        
        do you feel lucky punk? was it 5 or 6, I lost count myself in the excitement. So do you feel lucky or not? which is it punk?
        
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        December 27, 2016 5:58pm
      - dirty harry
        
        You seem to miss starboard milkbottle, almost bordering on obsession, how very strange. You are a strange one alright.
        
        8 2
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        December 27, 2016 7:02pm
      - pentwig
        
        apparently that your mum is good in bed milky
        
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        December 27, 2016 8:36pm
    - mikenmild
      
      Sure starboard.
      
      4 6
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      December 27, 2016 7:04pm
      - dirty harry
        
        wow..obsession much. Do you have pictures of him in your bedroom ? Weirdo.
        
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        December 27, 2016 7:35pm
- GoVege
  
  Good Ole Maori Party: Wana send fishing boats into a fish sanctuary….would they be staffed by Maori or virtual slaves from overseas I wonder?
  Are apparently against Maori kids having their best interests come first rather than the whanau getting to say where they stay.
  And guess who is behind all the millions spent lately on emergency housing presumably including motels at a grand a week?
  Yes…. the MP!
  Could someone please whisper in their ear. ..if you don’t aim for 10 kids per woman, you might not end up needing emergency housing.
  
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  December 27, 2016 7:49pm
  - nasska
    
    My bet would be on the virtual slaves Go Vege. I know a few deckies who crew on the local crayboats & a couple of them used to do a few cruises of the Southern Ocean in the off season chasing the hoki.
    
    The boats they crewed on were based in Westport fishing the quota handed to the Maori tribes as part of the Sealord Settlement. Part of the deal was that the owners had to employ a couple of Maori or the boat couldn’t sail.
    
    It was normal for the boat to be fuelled, provisioned & ready to go except for a couple of token Maori. Apparently big money coupled with a bit of Kupe’s dna isn’t enough to get our brave warriors much past the 100 kilometre limit before they are missing their whanau & mummy tucking them up at night.
    
    Go figure!
    
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    December 27, 2016 8:08pm
    - GoVege
      
      I suppose that’s the result when people get used to getting paid for doing nothing.
      
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      December 27, 2016 9:13pm
nasska

Public toilets will be closed for a day tomorrow in memory of George Michael.
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December 27, 2016 6:14pm
- stephieboy
  
  nasska, taking a day off your cottaging tomorrow in solemn memory ?
  
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  December 27, 2016 7:48pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Oh, saying Nasska meets strange men in toilets for sodomy is truly offensive.
    
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    December 27, 2016 8:20pm
    - mikenmild
      
      How?
      
      2 6
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      December 27, 2016 8:22pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Because Stephie is homophobic and he means it as a slur.
        
        6 3
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        December 27, 2016 8:25pm
      - mikenmild
        
        So it depends on a reading of intent, you poofter?
        
        3 7
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        December 27, 2016 8:31pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Blow me Mikey
        
        8 1
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        December 27, 2016 8:33pm
    - Gabby
      
      Snoflake-on-behalf.
      
      2 7
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      December 27, 2016 8:36pm
  - pentwig
    
    fool daffy
    
    4 3
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    December 27, 2016 8:39pm
- GoVege
  
  Nasska:
  I read somewhere that if women were as frisky as the average guy, they’d be dropping their drawers under the nearest bush or at the local gents/ladies, the same as gay fellas.
  It’s only the natural restraint built into the female psyche, that deters such behaviour among heterosexuals.
  
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  December 28, 2016 12:19am
cha

I wonder if the Putin fanbois realise he puts anti-Semites in the dock for hate speech…

Moscow, December 23, Interfax – The Basmanny Court of Moscow has imposed a 100,000 ruble (about $1650) fine on an ex-chief of the Federal Agency on Press and Mass Communications (Rospechat) Boris Mironov, who was charged with calls for extremism, according to the verdict read out by judge Yulia Safina.

[…]

The criminal case was opened after two of Mironov’s books, Russians. The last frontier and The battle against Judaist yoke, were declared extremist by the Zamoskvoretsky Court of Moscow on October 13 and December 12, 2014.

http://www.interfax-religion.com/?act=news&div=13505
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December 27, 2016 6:25pm
- stephieboy
  
  cha , two things to recall and one is that the Israeli PM and Mr Putin are on cordial terms . Next the Judge would likely have in mind the 1.5 million Jews the Nazis murdered in occupied Russia.,
  
  https://padresteve.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/einsatzgruppen-nazi-death-squads-ww2-german-brutal-002_thumb.jpg
  
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  December 27, 2016 7:53pm
  - EAD
    
    Next the Judge would likely have in mind the 1.5 million Jews the Nazis murdered in occupied Russia
    
    What about the 30 million Russians murdered by the Jewish Bolsheviks?
    What about the 25 million Russians that died at the hands of the Nazis? If anyone had reason to moan about dem Naaaaazzzziiiis, surely it’d be the Russians.
    
    These are the 55 million that we never hear about. Instead we get the mythical (and it is mythical) 6 million rammed down our throat and that didn’t even happen. Evil incarnate.
    
    This is the real poison. It is impossible to imagine what kind of people would foment a conflict, whose partial aim was to destroy tens of millions of lives, and then to invent an endless narrative, based on a monstrous lie, whereby (((they))) are not merely the worst, but the only real victims. It is a lie so gross, so grotesque, so evil that it ought (if any sanity and decency remained in the world at the national level) to result in the utter banishment into the outermost pits of oblivion of its foul and malefic perpetrators.
    
    Instead of which we have USA Presidents (all of them) and European leaders grovelling before their despicable and endlessly proliferating holohoax memorials, and in effect prostrating themselves before their (((masters))).
    
    When you know the truth, it makes one sick. It also makes me unutterably sad and angry about NZs involvement in WWII, as we we signed up to a war based on lies, falsehoods & propaganda.
    
    Go read Tell the Truth And Shame The Devil written by honourable Jew Gérard Menuhin.
    
    https://www.amazon.com/Tell-Truth-Shame-Devil-2015/dp/193778729X
    
    As the top rated review says:
    
    I didn’t know that one of the sons (Gerard) of the great violinist, Yehudi Menuhin, was a writer, but I came across this just-published book, and it’s a revelation. Mr. Menuhin is a holocaust revisionist; a hoax, he says, to keep extorting money from Germans. He’s not alone. Norman Finkelstein, whose mother and father (and Elie Wiesel) survived Auschwitz, called the holocaust a “giant extortion racket.” About WW2, Mr. Menuhin agrees with Pat Buchanan (Churchill, Hitler and the Unnecessary War) that the war need not have been fought.
    
    There’s much more. Mr. Menuhin is very hard on Israel and “self-chosen” Jews. Of his own family, he says “If all Jews were like the Menuhins, there would be no Jewish question and NO ANTI-JUDAISM!” But “Unfortunately neither two nor 1,000 of the righteous suffice to atone for the damage caused daily by millions of Jews in the world of international finance”. It is that “world of international finance” that he blames for forcing war upon Hitler and the National Socialists.
    
    It is 450 pages, packed with historical information and opinion, but easy reading. In our politically correct era, it takes a Jew to write so fearlessly on these forbidden subjects. No gentile would dare write in this vein. Proof, Mr. Menuhin, would say, of Jewish control of opinion and media, of what’s acceptable discourse and what’s not.
    
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    December 27, 2016 8:20pm
    - mikenmild
      
      No matter how many times a lunatic posts bullshit; it remains bullshit.
      
      5 7
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      December 27, 2016 8:24pm
      - EAD
        
        The great enemy of truth is very often not the lie – deliberate, contrived and dishonest – but the myth – persistent, persuasive and unrealistic. Too often we hold fast to the cliches of our forebears. We subject all facts to a prefabricated set of interpretations. We enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought
        
        – JFK, executed one year later after threatening the Federal Reserve that he’d launch non interesting bearing silver based coinage.
        
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        December 27, 2016 8:32pm
      - pentwig
        
        you or daffy?
        or both of you?
        
        5 2
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        December 27, 2016 8:57pm
    - stephieboy
      
      EAD , wev’e been throught this all before but here is once again a precis of what I’ve pointed out before
      
      1 Yes there were Many Jews in the Bolshevik Party as there the same in it’s rival the Mensheviks which Lenin eliminated .
      
      2. The Jewish membership overall of the Bolsheviks was very small no more than 5% of the total.
      
      3. Yes Trotsky was a Jew and others on the Politburo like so but most of whom Stalin had eliminated and murdereed by 1937-8. Yagoda too and replaced by Beria a gentile .
      
      4 Henceforth hardly any Jews occupied signiicant positions of power and influence and that is right until the fall of the Soviet Union in 1991
      
      You appear to be impervious to these very basic facts of Soviet Communsit history . I believe it is a delibrate mendacity on your part to bolster your unyiedling hatred of the Jewish people .
      
      Pure and Simple
      
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      December 27, 2016 9:39pm
  - pentwig
    
    why would the judge have that in mind?
    fuckwit
    
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    December 27, 2016 8:41pm
BeeSting

First Visit is to Christian Syrians

http://www.euronews.com/2016/12/26/aleppo-celebrates-christmas-as-assad-visits-damascus-convent

Knows his History has read his Bible and knows the way forward.

Healing, Forgiveness, Respect and Cooperation.

Everything the World Scorns.
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December 27, 2016 6:36pm
- stephieboy
  
  Beesting ,
  
  “Healing, Forgiveness, Respect and Cooperation.”
  
  Muslims included ?
  
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alawites
  
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  December 27, 2016 7:58pm
nasska

Twas the day after Christmas & all through the house,
Every creature was hurting– even the mouse.

The toys were all broken, their batteries dead;
Santa passed out, with some ice on his head.

Wrapping & ribbons just covered the floor, while
Upstairs the family continued to snore.

And I in my T-shirt, new Reeboks & jeans,
Went into the kitchen and started to clean.

When out on the lawn there arose such a clatter,
I sprang from the sink to see what was the matter.

Away to the window I flew like a flash,
Tore open the curtains, and threw up the sash.

When what to my wondering eyes should appear,
A red & white van to our gate did draw near.

The driver was smiling, in his van he did coast,
The patch on his jacket said “NZ POST.”

With a handful of bills, he grinned like a fox
Then quickly he stuffed them into our letterbox.

Bill after bill, after bill, the envelopes came.
Whistling & shouting he called them by name:

“Here’s Farmers’s, here’s Visa, now American Express,
Mastercard, the Warehouse…..all to excess”.

“To the tip or your limit, every store, every mall,
You booked it up, booked it up, booked it up all!”

He whooped & he whistled as he finished his work.
He filled up the box & then turned with a jerk.

He sprang to his van & he drove down the road,
Driving much faster with just half a load.

Then I heard him exclaim with great holiday cheer,
“ENJOY WHAT YOU GOT … YOU’LL BE PAYING ALL YEAR!”
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December 27, 2016 6:52pm
Nostradamus

Attention Kiwibloggers – this is a serious announcement.

On 22 October 2016 UglyTruth (or “Uggers” as he’s affectionately known at YourNZ) posted this link with apparent approval (his exact words were “Interesting timing”):

A document released by the Benenson Strategy Group on behalf of the Clinton Foundation reveals that Hillary’s Presidential Campaign is in dire straits due to mistrust over mainstream media coverage and polling. The document analyses a number of salvage scenarios and recommends one called FIRESIGN which is a false flag extraterrestrial invasion using advanced holographic technology.

The seven page document is titled “Salvage Program” was written less than a week ago, and was leaked by Anonymous on October 18, in a video, and later made available through the Before Its News website which has a questionable reputation for releasing accurate information.

Gezza responded:

This is excellent stuff Uggers. If it’s right, we should be seeing some awesome special effects & action scenes before 9 November.

Now, I don’t know about you guys, but I don’t think Gezza took this matter seriously. The idea of a “false flag extraterrestrial invasion using advanced holographic technology” must be taken seriously. What should we do about this grave threat to human civilisation?
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December 27, 2016 8:21pm
- nasska
  
  Any confirmation to hand of an alliance between the extraterrestrials & the lizard people Nostra?
  
  They could use a pincer move & encircle the Illuminati. 🙂
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:34pm
  - Nostradamus
    
    Nasska:
    
    I’m sure if you ask nicely, and pay the required fee, UglyTruth will confirm anything (however implausible) that you’d like confirmed:
    
    UglyTruth (2,167 comments) says:
    September 24th, 2013 at 1:31 pm
    
    So you are going to go with “the queen is a lizard”?
    
    No. All I’m saying is that there is enough seriously odd evidence to consider the possibility than a malevolent alien force or species has an active interest in western political institutions. It’s an outcome of the denial of the nature of UFOs, the western history of treachery and genocide, the Bohemian Grove connection between western elites and the occult, and the association between genocide, Nazis, the occult, and the Bush crime family.
    
    Now, in all honesty, I have no idea what that means – but hopefully you can find out and get back to us!
    
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    December 27, 2016 8:45pm
    - nasska
      
      It’s getting out of my league Nostra. I am after all just a simple cockie.
      
      Reid’s the bloke we need to sort this out. 🙂
      
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      December 27, 2016 8:52pm
- Reid
  
  What should we do about this grave threat to human civilisation?
  
  What’s your theory about this which happened in Norway when Obama was getting his [what has turned out to be a joke] Nobel?
  
  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80__LLZK4zg
  
  My view is: until we’re confident we know everything, we should suspend judgement. Then we start judging. And boy, lookout then,
  
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  December 27, 2016 8:51pm
  - Nostradamus
    
    Reid:
    
    The YouTube page links to Wikipedia (yes I know…)
    
    On 10 December 2009, the Russia Ministry of Defence suggested an explanation, stating that a Bulava missile test had failed. According to a spokesman, “The missile’s first two stages worked as normal, but there was a technical malfunction at the next, third, stage of the trajectory.”[9] Russian defence analyst Pavel Felgenhauer stated to AFP that “such lights and clouds appear from time to time when a missile fails in the upper layers of the atmosphere and have been reported before … At least this failed test made some nice fireworks for the Norwegians.”[12] Prior to the Russian statement, Jonathan McDowell, an astrophysicist at the Harvard–Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics, had already suggested that the unusual light display occurred when the missile’s third stage nozzle was damaged, causing the exhaust to come out sideways and sending the missile into a spin.[7]
    
    Presumably Russia had no particular reason to support Obama at that time?
    
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    December 27, 2016 8:58pm
Nostradamus

Reid:

I’m not a missile expert, or a pyrotechnics expert for that matter, so I can’t answer your question directly.

But there are some obvious questions. If aliens are out there, why are they wasting everyone’s time with the slow-reveal strip-tease? If they wanted to destroy us, presumably they have the technological means to do so, so why don’t they? If they wanted to enslave us, presumably they have the ability to control us, so why don’t they?

Edit: You seem to have deleted the comment I was responding to?
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December 27, 2016 9:04pm
- nasska
  
  ….”they have the ability to control us, so why don’t they?”……
  
  The death ray Reid has secreted in the hedge behind his house has them scared off.
  
  For now! 🙂
  
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  December 27, 2016 9:09pm
- mikenmild
  
  Even Reid must sometimes have second thoughts about the bullshit he posts.
  
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  December 27, 2016 9:13pm
- Reid
  
  Because there are two types Nosty, those who wish to destroy and those who wish to leave this primitive civilisation to develop in the hope it will one day become an aware part of the cosmos.
  
  The good guys can fuck the bad guys over really, really badly if they don’t let things play out.
  
  That’s why.
  
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  December 27, 2016 9:22pm
Viking2

Georgia Becomes First State To BAN Muslim Culture In Historic Move To Restore Western Culture

When Donald Trump proposed in 2015 that we place a temporary ban on Muslims entering the United States, it was at a time when Europe was experiencing historical levels of migrations and terrorism. ISIS was carrying out terrorist attacks weekly and hundreds of innocent people were getting killed.

Whether it was a jihadi running over 85 people with a truck, the Paris bombings, or even the German priest that was beheaded for being a Christian–they all were fueled by Islam. People need to understand that Islam is very dangerous and contradicts everything we believe in the United States.

A Georgia state legislator has introduced legislation that would ban burqas and traditional Muslim veils.

https://conservativedailypost.com/georgia-becomes-first-state-to-ban-muslim-culture-in-historic-move-to-restore-western-culture/

Its all on now then.
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December 27, 2016 9:07pm
Viking2

While past lame duck presidents focused on a smooth transition of power leading up to inauguration day, Obama is once again proving he is UNLIKE the others; and not in a good way.

During his lame duck time, Obama has continued with his reckless and treasonous actions. He continues to do nothing about securing the borders, while enacting policies allowing thousands of “Muslim refugees,” (aka: Islamic terrorists) to flood into the US. He is also ignoring the greater threat North Korea’s become to the US and its NATO allies.

Inciting Russian President Vladimir Putin with dangerous threats of “armed conflict” actions against the leader’s country. Obama continues to embolden Iran by illegally giving back billions to state sponsored terrorist nation to build advanced nuclear weapons systems that will, if given the opportunity, be used against the US’s most loyal allied in the Middle East, Israel.

https://conservativedailypost.com/israel-left-helpless-without-defense-as-obama-approves-irreversible-pro-palestine-deal-into-action/

Some serious reading. NZ was foolish. But then mfat is dumb.
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December 27, 2016 9:12pm
- Viking2
  
  Thursday afternoon, the Obama administration officially ended a post-9/11 era registration system for immigrant men from Muslim countries.
  
  The decision to scrap the National Security Entry-Exit Registration System (NSEERS) comes as a final move by Obama to allow as many Muslims into the country as possible before he leaves office in 29 days. amid growing international terror fears and President-elect Donald Trump’s suggestions that he could ban Muslim immigrants from the United States.
  
  Trump said Wednesday, “You know my plans.”
  
  https://conservativedailypost.com/110000-hidden-soldiers-obama-ends-muslim-tracking-system-and-increases-refugee-influx/
  
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  December 27, 2016 9:29pm
  - stephieboy
    
    Viking 2 , wrong. The so called tracking and registation sytem was introduced by GWB to keep tabs on Al Qeada operatives and suspects from Arab countries .
    
    It was found to be largely ineffective .
    
    Ban Muslim immigrants ? From those countries that the US has strong ties ecomically and militarily such as Saudia Arabia and Gulf states .?
    
    I very much doubt it .!
    
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    December 27, 2016 10:34pm
Viking2

New Zealand’s ambassador to Israel has been effectively banned from the country in a further retaliation against the recent critical United Nations Security Council resolution.

Israel has summoned representatives from Security Council members and ordered the Foreign Ministry to reduce work ties with countries who voted to pass a resolution condemning Israel’s continued settlements in the occupied territories.

On Saturday, the Israeli Government recalled its ambassador from New Zealand after the Security Council voted in favour of passing the resolution.

New Zealand co-sponsored the resolution, which said the settlements violate international law and undermine a two-state solution in Israel’s conflict with Palestine.

The resolution demanded that “Israel immediately and completely cease all settlement activities in the occupied Palestinian territory, including East Jerusalem.”

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11773528

That’ll tell us.
Crawling up Obama’s arse.
another Mccully fuckup. When is he quitting?
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December 27, 2016 9:46pm
- Reid
  
  Best move McCully ever made. Prior to this I used to think his entire career was a complete and utter fuck up, now with this, he’s redeemed himself, forever.
  
  Hooray!
  
  🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂
  
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  December 27, 2016 9:53pm
- Manolo
  
  McCully should have been pensioned off years ago, and yet PM English has chosen to keep him. Difficult to understand.
  
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  December 27, 2016 10:55pm
Viking2

Kiwi diplomat Jonathan Curr is also ambassador to Turkey, Azerbaijan, Georgia, and Jordan.

Excuse Me. The same diplomat for the Islamic countries as for Israel.

Whose grand plan was that?

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11773528
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December 27, 2016 9:52pm
- stephieboy
  
  Viking 2 , Georgia is not a Muslim country for starters .
  
  Poosibly the reason is that we do lttle trade with all those countries so it makes sense to have one size fits all .
  
  I dont think most of those countries you mentioned don’t t really care about who Jonathan Curr is ambssador to whom .
  
  BTW , whose our Amassador to Armenia and Moldavia ?
  
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  December 27, 2016 10:05pm
BeeSting

I just Flushed the Radiator on my Ford Falcon.
Praise the Lord.

It was not a deliberate, subversive or covert
act of Anti Semitism.

Great Car Dual Fuel cheaper than a Toyota Corolla to run or maybe even a Volkswagon. So reliable heaps of Power can do $1000km open road without refilling intend to take it to 1000,000km and get another just like it

Henry
He knew Russia would break the chains of Communism someday said something like

“When Russia Turns the World will tremble”

What scares people is not the nukes
he will do
Multi Culturalism and

Get it Right
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December 27, 2016 10:00pm
- Fletch
  
  My folks had a dual-fuel petrol/LPG system back in the 1980s when it seemed to be the thing. I didn’t know they still did it. I thought it kind of fell out of favour.
  
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  December 27, 2016 10:06pm
  - All_on_Red
    
    Not so sure you get heaps of power with LPG( if that’s what he’s got)
    
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    December 27, 2016 10:13pm
    - Fletch
      
      Actually, it was CNG they had, now that I remember – not LPG.
      
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      December 27, 2016 10:17pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        Sort of pointless today. Cars are more efficient and the cost of petrol isn’t so bad.
        
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        December 27, 2016 10:19pm
    - BeeSting
      
      Go for Factory Fitted LPG only about 5%-10% difference in power open road.
      Find a good one and keep it.
      They do not make em any more.
      
      If you do not get min 500,000km out of a
      Falcon Engine there be something wrong with you.
      
      We are going to the Moon
      Mooning so to speak
      
      If I want to waste money like a retard I push the
      petrol button
      
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      December 27, 2016 10:27pm
      - All_on_Red
        
        How old is this Falcon?
        
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        December 27, 2016 10:32pm
      - Fletch
        
        The Falcon – made the Kessel Run in less than 12 parsecs.
        
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        December 28, 2016 10:17am
    - Ed Snack
      
      LPG was fine, and was well thought of by people who used it with the major issues being a lack of refuelling places and the fact that the tank usually took up a lot of the boot space. But it burnt clean and delivered just as much power as petrol.
      
      CNG on the other hand was generally considered a bit of a dog. The tanks were bigger as the fuel was a compressed gas not a liquid, the range was poor and the power output of a CNG converted engine was usually about 15-20% down on the petrol equivalent – very noticeable. A similar lack of refuelling locations was also an issue.
      
      CNG was quite a thing in the late 1970’s what with the “oil crisis” and all that. LPG was around earlier but but NZ doesn’t (and didn’t) produce LPG in any quantity and there weren’t the facilities for the large scale importation of LPG, so there wasn’t the same potential for it to take off.
      
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      December 28, 2016 11:18am
- Awww C-mon
  
  Yeah that confirms it TBH,
  
  Duel Fuel Coon, you need serious help!
  
  I can not and will not interact with someone so completely without morals or taste.
  
  Take your cheese cutter, tweed jacket and poor excuse of a mostache and be gone!
  
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  December 27, 2016 10:17pm
  - BeeSting
    
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_GT40#/media/File:GT40_at_Goodwood.jpg
    
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_GT40
    
    Godless Heathen
    
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_GT40#/media/File:Le_Mans_1966.jpg
    
    Henry Ford II along with Bruce McLaren and Chris Amon celebrates the first victory for an American manufacturer at the 24 Hours of Le Mans on the podium in 1966.
    
    You are one of these Clueless Morons
    who does not even know that the Most
    Successful Formula 1 Team in World History
    
    Started its History with a Race on
    Muriwai Beach
    
    West Auckland
    
    WEST IS BEST
    
    http://cars.mclaren.com/featured-articles/bruces-first-race.html
    
    Praise the Lord and Pass the Ammunition
    Us Pilgrims have further to travel.
    
    Great Vehicles -As a Long Range Cruiser
    
    TECHNOPHOBES
    
    WEST IS BEST
    
    Shane Van Gisbergen
    Keeping the Faith
    Having Fun in between wipping ozzy
    a r s es
    
    Test Driver for McClaren
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVwY0JUK-O4
    
    Once more
    
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1B9i0q9OUNM
    
    READ YOUR BIBLE and LEARN HOW TO DRIFT
    
    FFS
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkUFQAgEX5Q
    
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    December 27, 2016 10:46pm
    - Awww C-mon
      
      The Gis is in a Holden you fucking muppet! You can’t even get your your story straight when you are trying to troll!
      
      You are more incompetent than fucking Gabby, how an oxygen thief like you even manages to turn on a computer is beyond me.
      
      And do not have the audacity to compare you piece of shit duel fuel mobile chicane to a GT40 shit for brains.
      
      Just cause your cousin has a pussy doesn’t mean you’re fucking Miranda Kerr every time you launch yourself onto her fat arse.
      
      Now fuck off.
      
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      December 28, 2016 6:04am
Manolo

Trendy and fashionable, as per the elites decree:
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/26/arts/design/the-fashion-of-islam-to-arrive-at-de-young-in-2018.html?_r=0&mtrref=drudgereport.com&gwh=ADC6ADE7A188139D52E66181A7762B8E&gwt=pay
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December 27, 2016 10:09pm
stephieboy

Manolo, “elites decree ” ? Who is enforcing it and under pain of what penalty ?

https://cdn.vectorstock.com/i/thumb-large/29/91/10052991.jpg
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December 27, 2016 10:12pm
- Maggy Wassilieff
  
  stephieboy, don’t you follow the fashion columns?
  http://www.newyorker.com/culture/culture-desk/the-year-in-fashion-down-with-the-elites
  
  penalty? … we wouldn’t want to discover that you’ve made a fashion faux-pas
  
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  December 27, 2016 10:27pm
  - stephieboy
    
    Maggy W, as per Manolo,
    
    “Trendy and fashionable, as per the elites decree:”
    
    ???
    
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    December 27, 2016 10:44pm
    - Maggy Wassilieff
      
      you’ve got to get out more, stephieboy…
      
      read Manolo’s 10:24 posting… and you might learn who some of the elites are…
      
      Have you ever heard of Manolo Blahnik?…. He’s one of the elite.
      
      Do you think KB”s Manolo could possibly be one of the elites?
      (p.s. if you are not one of the elites, you are a dreg)
      
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      December 27, 2016 10:56pm
      - Manolo
        
        Actually, Blahnik is my surname, but I’m too shy to use it in KB.
        
        Give me your Gisborne address and I’ll send you a pair of my latest creations. ?
        
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        December 27, 2016 10:59pm
      - Maggy Wassilieff
        
        I only wear redbands
        (steel-capped preferred)
        
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        December 27, 2016 11:01pm
Manolo

Wants to continue ruining the USA. Always a progressive:
http://dailycaller.com/2016/12/26/obama-to-muster-organizers-journos-pols-for-next-generation-of-progressive-leaders/

President Barack Obama’s long-term goal when he leaves office will be to marshal in a new generation of progressive leaders.

In an interview with his former senior advisor David Axelrod for CNN’s “The Axe Files” podcast, Obama explained his vision is “to build that next generation of leadership: organisers, journalists, politicians.”
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December 27, 2016 10:17pm
Manolo

Worth reading:
http://thefederalist.com/2016/12/23/the-audacity-of-hope/
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December 27, 2016 10:24pm
- stephieboy
  
  Manolo, The Federalist known for its Pro “The Kenyan’s” persuasions ?
  
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  December 27, 2016 10:40pm
  - Manolo
    
    Approach your reading with an open mind, dear stephieboy. Only then you will be able to draw your own conclusions.
    
    You will be much better off if you follow this darkie’s advice.
    
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    December 27, 2016 10:50pm

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