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October 17, 2005 10:57am by David Farrar

How do you know that a deal’s been done?

When Russell Brown starts defending Winston Peters!!

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Russell Brown

🙂

I’ll wear that one. But I’m right.

The deal was as good as done *before* National launched its spoof offer on Friday afternoon, and whatever else one might think about Winston, he can’t fairly be accused of going to National to try and put the squeeze on Labour, because he didn’t. National’s ppoposed coalition was *never* serious.

So now we all get to sit back and worry about the extra spending commitments …

Cheers,
RB
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October 17, 2005 12:36pm
David Farrar

I’m glad it was a spoof offer. A serious one would have alarmed me!
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October 17, 2005 12:40pm
Russell Brown

“I’m glad it was a spoof offer. A serious one would have alarmed me!”

Oh, don’t. You’ve got *me* worried now …

Cheers,
RB
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October 17, 2005 12:43pm
Graeme Edgeler

You’ve both got me worried – what does it mean when Russell Brown knows more about what’s going on inside National than David Farrar?
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October 17, 2005 1:35pm
tim barclay

Now that Winston is bought will he stay bought, he has been a Minister twice before and lasted about 18 months. Minister of Foreign Affairs outside cabinet. What rot, just means Helen Clark will be the real Minister. Peters wants to take the credit for the easy decisions but what about the hard ones, that are coming up?? Will he say that is not me. It has been an easy 5+ years for Helen Clark, she has not had to do anything unpopular. But that is going to change very soon.
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October 17, 2005 1:37pm
Craig Ranapia

Graeme:

With more than due respect to Russell’s splendid intelligence network, I don’t think linking to the Herald is exactly getting down with Deep Throat.

Still, it’s going to fun seeing “the detail on the detail” – though I pity Cullen having to front the costings on the costings, and watch Clark try to explain the coalition that isn’t really a coalition (with the Foreign Affairs Minister who isn’t really in Cabinet, but will still be bound by collective responsibility and required to answer questions in the House).

How could anyone blame National for stirring up that particular pot?
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October 17, 2005 1:57pm
Rob Hosking

I just don’t beleive a lot of of what I’m reading about the talks. I’m a bit more remvoed from it thatn I’d like to be because of of family commitments, but from what I’ve observed – and also from what I hear from people who have worked for Peters – I can’t see him taking the foreign affairs job outside Cabinet.

I don’t see Labour seriously offering it to him either. I’m quite prpeared tob e wrong on this – and I think we’ll know by this time tomorrow – but what I’ve seen so far just doesnt’ add up.
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October 17, 2005 2:42pm
Tony Milne

I can understand why his party will be upset. If Winston becomes Foreign Affairs Minister he will be spending most of his time away from New Zealand and will be unable to raise his Party’s profile. The move could kill NZ First as a Party, but will allow Winston to exit from politics as a Minister. What Ministerial post will be offered to Dunne?
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October 17, 2005 2:59pm
Gooner

“The move could kill NZ First as a Party,…”

Change ‘could’ to ‘will’. Woolerton is pissed off ‘cos he now has to do some work keeping the party going. Gee, ain’t this politics tough Doug.
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October 17, 2005 3:18pm
Russell Brown

“The move could kill NZ First as a Party, but will allow Winston to exit from politics as a Minister. ”

That’s why I described it as a valedictiory post. It does look to me like the kind of job – nice travel perks and all – that you’d finish up on.

Cheers,
RB
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October 17, 2005 3:29pm
Michael

Given that he’s been fired from every other Ministerial job he’s been given, how long will this one last.

I think National’s Friday offer was genuine. If the Nat Leadership can prevent Hel’s from getting power and still be able to get through most policy it campaigned on then they’ll go for it.
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October 17, 2005 3:46pm
Ed Snack

The valedictory post idea seems to be a gross insult to Winston, if such a thing is possible. Would he really sell his party and other MPs so far down the river ? I suspect he might have more serious problems than just Woolerton leaving if that is the case. If too blantant, Helen may be buying just one vote.

New elections anyone ?
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October 17, 2005 3:48pm
David P

Australia’s electoral system quickly consigned One Nation to oblivion. Whereas MMP makes the equivalent NZ party the tail that consistently wags the dog. It’s a sad commentary on NZ politics that an anti-immigrant popularist is going to be a winner, regardless of who is in government.

But it could be fun when the new Minister of Foreign Affairs makes it overseas, and finds that the rest of the world is full of wogs and chinks and the other people that he wants to keep out of NZ.
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October 17, 2005 3:59pm
Rob Hosking

Well, we’ll know shortly – Labour caucus meeting at the moment, press conference shortly!
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October 17, 2005 4:03pm
Rob Hosking

Well, we’ll know shortly – Labour caucus meeting at the moment, press conference shortly!
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October 17, 2005 4:06pm
Jake

winston is foreign minister, maori are in opposition. it will be announced on national radio at 5pm.

=)
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October 17, 2005 4:26pm
Ben Wilson

If only there was a minister for Stewart Island.
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October 17, 2005 4:53pm
LMD

Cringe. Winston and Alexander Downer. Now there’s a meeting made in heaven. How does anyone expect the antipodes to be taken seriously again.
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October 17, 2005 5:19pm
Ben Wilson

We’ll be right, as soon as we make The Hobbit. But it will be amusing to hear about the Brits whining at Winston about all the flippin’ Kiwi immigrants.
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October 17, 2005 5:30pm
LMD

I’m assuming you’ve seen this Ben. Took a while to reach Oz but v funny.

http://www.42below.com/flashad/storyof42/index.html
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October 17, 2005 5:58pm
darren

Oh yes, let’s have another election.
What with Winnie in foreign affairs and Dunny in government too, I doubt it will last.
Well done for National and ACT for staying outside government. Tempting as ending hellenista regime may be.
Prepare your ammo Don, get ready for round two.
I don’t think you will have to wait too long.
Six months, a year maybe, and you can slay the dragon.
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October 17, 2005 6:07pm
insider

And you thought Helen insulting Bush was bad for relations with our friends. What happens when Winston gooses Laura in the Oval Office, or invites George down to the Parrot or Mermaid for a couple of ounces, or suggests the twins jump in the taxi for a ride.

NZ the next pariah state ;-0
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October 17, 2005 6:22pm
Pamyla

No need for an new election Darren, John Howard in Australia has allready had a defeat in the Senate even though his coalition has a majority and no one is talking a new election either.
As you seem to have forgotten thye losers get off the stage for three years ( The last NP government went the full 3 yrs even though they wrecked their coalition deliberately when the malcontents in NP tossed out Jim Bolger)
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October 17, 2005 6:24pm
iain

bizarre, Winston as Foreign Affairs Minister

what next, Kaumatua Don ?, hang on , that was in the pipeline
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October 17, 2005 6:41pm
Graeme Edgeler

Of course, Winnie and Pete aren’t “in Government” or “in Coalition” =)

But I would like to remind everyone I said a few days ago on this site that the agreement would include a re-write of the cabinet office manual =)

Congratulations to Clark for having us all see Winston’s first hour in office involving his being driven in a Ministerial Limousine – one of the “baubles of office” his party never wanted.

And big ups to Doug Woolerton
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October 17, 2005 7:06pm
Ben Wilson

LMD, hadn’t seen it, but not bad.

3 Terms! I’d predict it’s the last, but predictions in politics are pretty inaccurate over 3 years. Clark looked like a shoo-in only 2 years ago.

I’m optimistic Peters can keep his cool. He appears to have finally realised that his economics are closer to Labour than his social policy is distant. His economic policy is just worlds away from the Nats, and their cheap opportunism of courting the Maori shows just how unreliable their social policy statements are.

Reminds me of when I was a student in 1990 – Peters was the only conservative politician that had the guts to even come onto the campus. He spoke in his typical rough-as-guts way, telling us how the Nats would reverse all of the free-market craziness of the last 6 years of Labour. The head of the student union yelled at him that his party would never do anything he was claiming, and he was an idiot to believe it, or a liar. He yelled back to sit-down and shut-up. Fair enough, I thought in the circumstances – we had come to hear Peters, not some jumped up punk.

Strangely, his party followed the intuition of the punk, and Peters (to my surprise) broke away from National. Perhaps Peters has finally heeded the kid’s words….
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October 17, 2005 8:08pm
Paul W

Darren: “Well done for National and ACT for staying outside government.”

This is your finest fella! The kind of incisive analysis that Fairfax must love you for!
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October 17, 2005 8:17pm
GMM

God this is funny. Have you seen the entries for Winnie, Dunnie, Clark and Maharey on wikipedia?
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October 17, 2005 8:32pm
Ben Wilson

I not only saw them, I added the comment that Peters had finally joined govt from outside…just doing my teensy tiny bit to keep the rest of the world informed, and wikipedia up to date. I was feeling generous to Peters, so I said he’d ‘kept his promise not to enter coalition’. Feel free to dispute it, edit it. Just starting the ball rolling…someone added some cryptic comment about the ascot, couldn’t really be arsed checking to see if it was just a joke.
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October 17, 2005 8:44pm
Ben Wilson

Ah, someone’s already made it ‘more encyclopedic’. Nice. Their wording was better than mine, I can only claim to have ‘got there first’. And the ascot thing got removed, whatever that was.

Amazing system. To think I carry it around in my PDA. My grandma almost had a heart attack when I told her it was much bigger than her monolithic (and 30 years out of date) encyclopedia brittanica set, was completely free, and it fits in my pocket along with 200 other books, 3 hours of my favourite music, hundreds of games etc. I decided not to scare her by adding that it also could play movies and connect to the internet, for browsing and email and skype, and wifi hotspots.

With something like that around, who cares who the government is.
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October 18, 2005 9:43am

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